Cycles Viewport render crashes often when reconnecting nodes. #40763

New Issue

marc dion · 2014-06-23T04:06:44+02:00

marc dion commented

2014-06-23 04:06:44 +02:00

System Information
Mavericks 10.9.1
i5, 16GB
Radeon 6670M, 512MB

Blender Version
Broken: both RC1 and RC2
Worked: (optional) things were mostly fine up until the release candidates.(It did happen before but it was rare)

Short description of error
When I'm setting up lighting and materials for a scene I'm going to bake, I leave the 3D Viewport render on and I move nodes around, changing settings and connections to see how things are looking. With both release candidates I'm experiencing a lot of crashes.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error

This is more of a head's up than a formal bug report.

Unfortunately I cannot give you the exact steps to reproduce a crash because I have not seen a definite pattern behind the crashes and I see no point in attaching a .blend file since it has been happening with different scenes and it does not always happen.
It's basically the same problem that Blender Internal Viewport rendering has had for at least the past year and a half. Random crashes when changing node trees with the Viewport rendering active.

I had two options here. Ignore the problem or file an incomplete report. I choose to file something that other people may be able to add something important to. Sometimes a problem like this can be solved when other people add a different point of view.

**System Information** Mavericks 10.9.1 i5, 16GB Radeon 6670M, 512MB **Blender Version** Broken: both RC1 and RC2 Worked: (optional) things were mostly fine up until the release candidates.(It did happen before but it was rare) **Short description of error** When I'm setting up lighting and materials for a scene I'm going to bake, I leave the 3D Viewport render on and I move nodes around, changing settings and connections to see how things are looking. With both release candidates I'm experiencing a lot of crashes. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** This is more of a head's up than a formal bug report. Unfortunately I cannot give you the exact steps to reproduce a crash because I have not seen a definite pattern behind the crashes and I see no point in attaching a .blend file since it has been happening with different scenes and it does not always happen. It's basically the same problem that Blender Internal Viewport rendering has had for at least the past year and a half. Random crashes when changing node trees with the Viewport rendering active. I had two options here. Ignore the problem or file an incomplete report. I choose to file something that other people may be able to add something important to. Sometimes a problem like this can be solved when other people add a different point of view.

marc dion commented

2014-06-23 04:06:44 +02:00

Changed status to: 'Open'

marc dion commented

2014-06-23 04:06:44 +02:00

Added subscriber: @MarcClintDion

Thomas Dinges commented

2014-06-24 12:19:13 +02:00

Added subscriber: @ThomasDinges

Thomas Dinges commented

2014-06-24 12:19:13 +02:00

You explicitly mention baking, does the crash also happen when you don't use the baking feature at all?

marc dion commented

2014-06-24 20:03:19 +02:00

This is happening before baking while I'm still preparing the materials and lighting.

I don't alter the node networks or keep the 3D Viewport Render active while a bake is taking place.

Usually the crash occurs when I unplug a node or as I'm plugging one in, and it's always when the 3D Viewport is active.

Normally I make a lot of slight changes very quickly so maybe it's possible that I'm changing data while the previous changes are still pending due to lag from the Viewport render.

Maybe I'll just slow down a bit. I'll let you know if it persists even while I'm being more careful.

This is happening before baking while I'm still preparing the materials and lighting. I don't alter the node networks or keep the 3D Viewport Render active while a bake is taking place. Usually the crash occurs when I unplug a node or as I'm plugging one in, and it's always when the 3D Viewport is active. Normally I make a lot of slight changes very quickly so maybe it's possible that I'm changing data while the previous changes are still pending due to lag from the Viewport render. Maybe I'll just slow down a bit. I'll let you know if it persists even while I'm being more careful.

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-06-25 10:13:46 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Sergey

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-06-25 10:13:46 +02:00

Just wondering, does it matter whether OSL is enabled or disabled?

marc dion commented

2014-06-25 11:51:47 +02:00

OSL scripting seems to still be off by default for the RC candidates, and since the lack of AA for baking leaves many OSL scripts unusable for baking I just leave it disabled unless I happen to be using the one script I know of which supports samples.

Sergey Sharybin self-assigned this 2014-06-25 11:58:23 +02:00

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-06-25 11:58:23 +02:00

I've commited some fixes at da64e8a. Please wait for a newer build to be available and test again.

I've commited some fixes at da64e8a. Please wait for a newer build to be available and test again.

Thomas Dinges commented

2014-06-29 13:25:35 +02:00

@MarcClintDion Please get back to us. Download a new build from builder.blender.org.

marc dion commented

2014-06-29 15:03:43 +02:00

sorry, Thomas, I did not mean to blow you off here. I just felt like I had nothing conclusive to report.

I tested a new build by loading a scene that had > 40 models and almost double this amount of textures then I activated the Viewport render and started to randomly adding, deleting, connecting nodes and making changes as fast as I could for about 5 mins. I then held down the undo keys continuously until all 64 were used.

No crash, but the reason I did not get back to you is because I did the same thing with RC2 and there was no crash there either even though that was one of the 2 builds repeatedly crashing for me.

However a day or two later, I was using RC2 because of an unrelated bug in the newest build and the scene was just getting started and there were only a couple simple default models, no textures and the Viewport render crashed Blender when I tried to add a texture to a plane.(totally random, and seemingly unrelated to scene complexity which I find odd as well).

I reopened Blender and repeated the exact same steps hoping to have a consistent test to try with the new build but this time I could not repeat the crash.

Anyways, I'm working on a couple scenes now but they are mostly in the modeling stage, maybe I'll start a thread on BA.org today asking people to report there if they've seen this since many people are more comfortable mentioning things like this in an informal setting. This way there will be more eyes watching.

I'll leave this tab open so I don't forget to say something more by the end of the week.

sorry, Thomas, I did not mean to blow you off here. I just felt like I had nothing conclusive to report. I tested a new build by loading a scene that had > 40 models and almost double this amount of textures then I activated the Viewport render and started to randomly adding, deleting, connecting nodes and making changes as fast as I could for about 5 mins. I then held down the undo keys continuously until all 64 were used. No crash, but the reason I did not get back to you is because I did the same thing with RC2 and there was no crash there either even though that was one of the 2 builds repeatedly crashing for me. However a day or two later, I was using RC2 because of an unrelated bug in the newest build and the scene was just getting started and there were only a couple simple default models, no textures and the Viewport render crashed Blender when I tried to add a texture to a plane.(totally random, and seemingly unrelated to scene complexity which I find odd as well). I reopened Blender and repeated the exact same steps hoping to have a consistent test to try with the new build but this time I could not repeat the crash. Anyways, I'm working on a couple scenes now but they are mostly in the modeling stage, maybe I'll start a thread on BA.org today asking people to report there if they've seen this since many people are more comfortable mentioning things like this in an informal setting. This way there will be more eyes watching. I'll leave this tab open so I don't forget to say something more by the end of the week.

Thomas Dinges commented

2014-06-29 15:09:05 +02:00

No problem, then let's wait a few more days, and if no crash happens we can close this one. :)

marc dion commented

2014-06-29 15:26:00 +02:00

Here's the thread, I'll post a link to it on some of the Cycles threads in a bit. http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?341591-Cycles-Viewprt-render-was-crashing-a-lot-for-the-RC-candidates-while-adjust-nodes&p=2677320#post2677320

Adam Friesen commented

2014-06-30 21:05:41 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Ace_Dragon

Adam Friesen commented

2014-06-30 21:05:41 +02:00

Hi.

I might be a little late here and this may or may not be related to this report, but I can confirm that there are some stability issues when tweaking nodes in a June 29th build on my 64 bit Win7 machine.

It seems like this mainly occurs when there's a lot of objects in the scene, tweaking node values while having a rendered view border render can lead to a crash when the process is restarted and F12 rendering can crash a bit if you tweak any UI settings before starting it.

There's more, after a rendering is stopped, the stability can sometimes be so rickety that simply doing any value change in the properties window will cause Blender to crash out.

So it seems to me like there might be a conflict that develops when Cycles is started amid use of the property and node UI windows.

Hi. I might be a little late here and this may or may not be related to this report, but I can confirm that there are some stability issues when tweaking nodes in a June 29th build on my 64 bit Win7 machine. It seems like this mainly occurs when there's a lot of objects in the scene, tweaking node values while having a rendered view border render can lead to a crash when the process is restarted and F12 rendering can crash a bit if you tweak any UI settings before starting it. There's more, after a rendering is stopped, the stability can sometimes be so rickety that simply doing any value change in the properties window will cause Blender to crash out. So it seems to me like there might be a conflict that develops when Cycles is started amid use of the property and node UI windows.

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-06-30 21:09:01 +02:00

If something is crasinh we really need a file which demonstrates it as often as possible.

marc dion commented

2014-06-30 22:14:44 +02:00

Sergey, I've been working on this but even before I filed this report, when I have a crash, I reopen the file and redo every step that I made before and there is never a crash when I follow all the same steps.

For instance, about 15 minutes ago, I copied some nodes from one material to another with the Viewport Render running and did not like the results, so I used Undo and the scene crashed. I opened the Autosave then did the exact same thing and there was no crash.

So far, I have not had a crash while making forward changes which is good, just the one while using undo.

This is proving very difficult to reproduce. I can't see a pattern.

Sergey, I've been working on this but even before I filed this report, when I have a crash, I reopen the file and redo every step that I made before and there is never a crash when I follow all the same steps. For instance, about 15 minutes ago, I copied some nodes from one material to another with the Viewport Render running and did not like the results, so I used Undo and the scene crashed. I opened the Autosave then did the exact same thing and there was no crash. So far, I have not had a crash while making forward changes which is good, just the one while using undo. This is proving very difficult to reproduce. I can't see a pattern.

Adam Friesen commented

2014-06-30 22:29:41 +02:00

Actually, I'm really starting to think that the bug here is a symptom of a greater stability issue that gets worse the more complex a scene gets, so real complex scenes in effect will be impossible to render even if you have the RAM for it.

This scene I just made, on my copy of Win7 64 bit at least, will without a doubt, crash 100 percent of the time providing you don't actually do anything before you hit F12,
http://www.mediafire.com/download/atji8kqby5kt2dg/Cycles_crashyScene.blend

Now the reason it's 7 megs with a lot of objects is because such a size is required to trigger the instability (small scenes are almost impossible to crash out easily), but it should be pretty straightforward since you just need to hit F12,

Here's the interesting part though, if I end up making changes to the material itself, then it will not crash when I hit F12, but it will start crashing again as soon I as save > quit Blender > start Blender > load file > F12.

Actually, I'm really starting to think that the bug here is a symptom of a greater stability issue that gets worse the more complex a scene gets, so real complex scenes in effect will be impossible to render even if you have the RAM for it. This scene I just made, on my copy of Win7 64 bit at least, will without a doubt, crash 100 percent of the time providing you don't actually do anything before you hit F12, http://www.mediafire.com/download/atji8kqby5kt2dg/Cycles_crashyScene.blend Now the reason it's 7 megs with a lot of objects is because such a size is *required* to trigger the instability (small scenes are almost impossible to crash out easily), but it should be pretty straightforward since you just need to hit F12, Here's the interesting part though, if I end up making changes to the material itself, then it will not crash when I hit F12, but it will start crashing again as soon I as save > quit Blender > start Blender > load file > F12.

Adam Friesen commented

2014-06-30 22:33:43 +02:00

Hi Marc; I didn't see your reply there, but if you're reading, you will notice that I believe I have found a way to produce a crash every time.

Can you confirm if following what I said crashes for you too?

Hi Marc; I didn't see your reply there, but if you're reading, you will notice that I believe I have found a way to produce a crash every time. Can you confirm if following what I said crashes for you too?

marc dion commented

2014-06-30 23:52:23 +02:00

ace_dragon: I tried the scene using both Viewport Render and a camera render. No crash for either.

Maybe you could add your system specs, and also whether you are using GPU or CPU render. Another OSX user reported on the BA thread that he saw no issues with either of the RC candidates(without the current fix) but he was also using GPU rendering and I only have access to CPU rendering.

ace_dragon: I tried the scene using both Viewport Render and a camera render. No crash for either. Maybe you could add your system specs, and also whether you are using GPU or CPU render. Another OSX user reported on the BA thread that he saw no issues with either of the RC candidates(without the current fix) but he was also using GPU rendering and I only have access to CPU rendering.

Adam Friesen commented

2014-07-01 00:08:52 +02:00

Have you tried saving the file, exiting Blender, reopening Blender and loading the file?

I use CPU rendering, and when I do that on Win7 it will crash providing the only thing you do is F12.

Interestingly enough, the viewport rendering doesn't crash the file, just the F12 rendering. If my suggestion doesn't get the file crashing on your system, then it's possible that the situations that result in crashes differ based on the OS and compiler used.

Have you tried saving the file, exiting Blender, reopening Blender and loading the file? I use CPU rendering, and when I do that on Win7 it will crash providing the only thing you do is F12. Interestingly enough, the viewport rendering doesn't crash the file, just the F12 rendering. If my suggestion doesn't get the file crashing on your system, then it's possible that the situations that result in crashes differ based on the OS and compiler used.

marc dion commented

2014-07-02 09:59:21 +02:00

Well, after 2 solid days of running the Viewport Render and working on materials with many, many adjustments for hours at a time, I've only had 1 crash when I drop and dragged a texture into the Node Editor. That happens once in a while, it's to be expected.

It's not like before(with the RC's) when Blender would often crash a couple minutes after getting started, then again shortly after, etc...

Now that Ace Dragon is here with more issues, things look more complicated, but so far as the original problem I reported, I think the issue is solved.

Thanks for the speedy fix.

Well, after 2 solid days of running the Viewport Render and working on materials with many, many adjustments for hours at a time, I've only had 1 crash when I drop and dragged a texture into the Node Editor. That happens once in a while, it's to be expected. It's not like before(with the RC's) when Blender would often crash a couple minutes after getting started, then again shortly after, etc... Now that Ace Dragon is here with more issues, things look more complicated, but so far as the original problem I reported, I think the issue is solved. Thanks for the speedy fix.

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-07-02 10:22:15 +02:00

Changed status from 'Open' to: 'Resolved'

Sergey Sharybin closed this issue

2014-07-02 10:22:15 +02:00

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-07-02 10:22:15 +02:00

No! Crashes are not to be expected! :)

Since the regression is solved now i'll close the report. And have a closer look into why something could crash here a bit later, planing to do some work on the import scene here anyway.

Thanks for the report!

P.S. Just one question: are you using OSL or crashes happens regardless of this?

No! Crashes are not to be expected! :) Since the regression is solved now i'll close the report. And have a closer look into why something could crash here a bit later, planing to do some work on the import scene here anyway. Thanks for the report! P.S. Just one question: are you using OSL or crashes happens regardless of this?

marc dion commented

2014-07-02 11:22:44 +02:00

Crashes were happening with OSL disabled.

And you're right, crashes are not a good thing and we'd all like to see them fixed.

When I say it's to be expected, this is because large software packages do crash from time to time. I can't think of one that is immune to this. It's not something to ignore, but it does happen.

I think for now on I will keep a journal with details of what I was doing when crashes and oddities happen even if they seem unconnected and unreproducible...

well, thanks again.

Crashes were happening with OSL disabled. And you're right, crashes are not a good thing and we'd all like to see them fixed. When I say it's to be expected, this is because large software packages do crash from time to time. I can't think of one that is immune to this. It's not something to ignore, but it does happen. I think for now on I will keep a journal with details of what I was doing when crashes and oddities happen even if they seem unconnected and unreproducible... well, thanks again.

Piotr Adamowicz commented

2014-07-02 13:14:32 +02:00

Added subscriber: @MadMinstrel

Piotr Adamowicz commented

2014-07-02 13:14:32 +02:00

I'm still experiencing crashes with 5898abe (buildbot), Windows 7 64bit.

It happens regardless of whether or not GPU or CPU is used, or whether OSL is used. Sometimes it happens without having the viewport in rendered mode at all (textured mode was on when I observed this).

If you get it to crash a few times in a row it happens more and more often, up to the point where it crashes each time you Shift-Z or do anything with the nodes.

Running an older version of Blender and rendering something, or opening an old file somehow magically cures the problem for a while. So there is no file that crashes consistently all the time that I could send.

Mysterious indeed.

I'm still experiencing crashes with 5898abe (buildbot), Windows 7 64bit. It happens regardless of whether or not GPU or CPU is used, or whether OSL is used. Sometimes it happens without having the viewport in rendered mode at all (textured mode was on when I observed this). If you get it to crash a few times in a row it happens more and more often, up to the point where it crashes each time you Shift-Z or do anything with the nodes. Running an older version of Blender and rendering something, or opening an old file somehow magically cures the problem for a while. So there is no file that crashes consistently all the time that I could send. Mysterious indeed.

Sign in to join this conversation.

No Label

Download

What's New

Blender Studio

Manual

Developers Blog

Documentation

Benchmark

Blender Conference

Development Fund

One-time Donations

Cycles Viewport render crashes often when reconnecting nodes. #40763