Viewport camera and Flying mode issue #49624

New Issue

Vyacheslav Kobozev · 2016-10-11T04:40:05+02:00

2016-10-11 04:40:05 +02:00

System Information
Win7 x64

Blender Version
Broken: 2.77, 2.78,

Short description of error
Size of navigatiom frame of Flying mode highly depends on camera focus length (viewport) and camera start of clipping distance.
So if I want to work with small details and setting about 5—10 mm start.
Turning becomes extremely slow.

And with 20 cm cliping start and 35 mm frame becomes too small and navigation too fast.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error
It happens after manipulating with focus length and clipping distance of viewport camera or even with camera object
Try with this blend file to adjust these values. Afterr few iterations navigation frame in flying mode can shrink to zero and it makes improssible to use this mode at all. This issue saves with file and do not appear in the new file or other scenes.

Flyissue.7z

**System Information** Win7 x64 **Blender Version** Broken: 2.77, 2.78, **Short description of error** Size of navigatiom frame of Flying mode highly depends on camera focus length (viewport) and camera start of clipping distance. So if I want to work with small details and setting about 5—10 mm start. Turning becomes extremely slow. And with 20 cm cliping start and 35 mm frame becomes too small and navigation too fast. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** It happens after manipulating with focus length and clipping distance of viewport camera or even with camera object Try with this blend file to adjust these values. Afterr few iterations navigation frame in flying mode can shrink to zero and it makes improssible to use this mode at all. This issue saves with file and do not appear in the new file or other scenes. [Flyissue.7z](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F376715/Flyissue.7z) ![FItiny.jpg](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F376716/FItiny.jpg) ![FI-mid.jpg](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F376718/FI-mid.jpg) ![FI-large.jpg](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F376720/FI-large.jpg)

Vyacheslav Kobozev commented

2016-10-11 04:40:05 +02:00

Changed status to: 'Open'

Vyacheslav Kobozev commented

2016-10-11 04:40:05 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Vyach

Sergey Sharybin commented

2016-10-11 11:46:46 +02:00

Added subscribers: @dfelinto, @Sergey

Dalai Felinto was assigned by Sergey Sharybin

2016-10-11 11:46:46 +02:00

Sergey Sharybin commented

2016-10-11 11:46:46 +02:00

Not sure it's indeed a clipping distance or lens which makes effect here. More like they just make effect more noticeable on such a small scene.

@dfelinto, think you're most familiar with such kinds of navigations. Can suggest anything?

Not sure it's indeed a clipping distance or lens which makes effect here. More like they just make effect more noticeable on such a small scene. @dfelinto, think you're most familiar with such kinds of navigations. Can suggest anything?

Dalai Felinto commented

2016-10-13 16:52:19 +02:00

Not sure it's indeed a clipping distance or lens which makes effect here. More like they just make effect more noticeable on such a small scene.

They both affect it when you are not in camera mode.

We could fix this (removing the dependency of clipping on the size and speed), but honestly, @Vyach is there a reason you are not using Walk Navigation instead?

I personally consider the Fly Mode semi-deprecated.

> Not sure it's indeed a clipping distance or lens which makes effect here. More like they just make effect more noticeable on such a small scene. They both affect it when you are not in camera mode. We could fix this (removing the dependency of clipping on the size and speed), but honestly, @Vyach is there a reason you are not using Walk Navigation instead? I personally consider the Fly Mode semi-deprecated.

Vyacheslav Kobozev commented

2016-10-15 18:55:18 +02:00

Fly mode have smooth moving and full control with digitizer, and I like It. Also I am using Del. very often to jump to the target.

Walk mode isnt smooth (id like little inertia) and controlled by keypad.
For my taste, I would like something smooth with more control by mouse/stylo:
Shift+F = switch mode
MMB = rotate (as default mode)
RMB = pan (left-right-top-down, as ADQE in the walk)
Mouse move = mouse look (like in the walk mode now)

The same buttons for navigation as in walk mode + Ctrl-mousemove for rotation for those ppl, who have not any buttons on their tablets and stylos.

Fly mode have smooth moving and full control with digitizer, and I like It. Also I am using Del. very often to jump to the target. Walk mode isn`t smooth (i`d like little inertia) and controlled by keypad. For my taste, I would like something smooth with more control by mouse/stylo: Shift+F = switch mode MMB = rotate (as default mode) RMB = pan (left-right-top-down, as ADQE in the walk) Mouse move = mouse look (like in the walk mode now) The same buttons for navigation as in walk mode + Ctrl-mousemove for rotation for those ppl, who have not any buttons on their tablets and stylos.

Dalai Felinto commented

2016-10-26 16:33:38 +02:00

Also I am using Del. very often to jump to the target.

Are you familiar with the teleport feature in the walking mode? (space key)

> Also I am using Del. very often to jump to the target. Are you familiar with the teleport feature in the walking mode? (space key)

Vyacheslav Kobozev commented

2016-10-27 08:08:20 +02:00

No, I was not familiar with.

Thanks, it is useful function.

No, I was not familiar with. Thanks, it is useful function.

adrian konrad commented

2018-02-26 00:35:26 +01:00

Added subscriber: @hotpants33

adrian konrad commented

2018-02-26 00:35:26 +01:00

Totally agree with Vyacheslav: fly mode is utterly superior to walk mode. If anything's semi-obsolete it's having your marvelous new Blender creation insulted by the nausea-inducing, cheap, cartoonish jerkiness of walk mode! The delicious, cushioned buoyancy of fly mode is, in fact, my standard viewing mode..
•
Not surprising, therefore, that I've identified exactly the same issue with the real Numpad0 camera's focal length frequently 'breaking' fly navigation in any other (virtual camera) view. Basically, the real camera wants a lowish (normal) focal length for things to look good, something like 13mm to 35mm for strong perspective depth... This then very often [always?] 'explodes' the fly mode dock in every other view, sometimes completely off-screen. This makes it inescapable & rotation, consequently, impossible. The 'fix' is to hugely increase the real camera's focal length (100-200mm) but now the camera view is horrendous, almost orthographically flat.
•
I've toyed with 'tricking' the virtual cameras into following the focal length of a sacrificial 'dummy' real camera (while I use a different real camera) but they always latch onto the active camera so it doesn't work.
•
Still totally love Blender though, & everyone who's done such incredible work to give it to the people!

Totally agree with Vyacheslav: fly mode is utterly superior to walk mode. If anything's semi-obsolete it's having your marvelous new Blender creation insulted by the nausea-inducing, cheap, cartoonish jerkiness of walk mode! The delicious, cushioned buoyancy of fly mode is, in fact, my standard viewing mode.. • Not surprising, therefore, that I've identified exactly the same issue with the real Numpad0 camera's focal length frequently 'breaking' fly navigation in any other (virtual camera) view. Basically, the real camera wants a lowish (normal) focal length for things to look good, something like 13mm to 35mm for strong perspective depth... This then very often [always?] 'explodes' the fly mode dock in every other view, sometimes completely off-screen. This makes it inescapable & rotation, consequently, impossible. The 'fix' is to hugely increase the real camera's focal length (100-200mm) but now the camera view is horrendous, almost orthographically flat. • I've toyed with 'tricking' the virtual cameras into following the focal length of a sacrificial 'dummy' real camera (while I use a different real camera) but they always latch onto the active camera so it doesn't work. • Still totally love Blender though, & everyone who's done such incredible work to give it to the people!

adrian konrad commented

2018-03-09 17:55:05 +01:00

A question on Stack Exchange ( https://blender.stackexchange.com/questions/76076/interactively-change-cameras-focal-length/76120#76120 ) made me realize that animating the real camera's focal length with an f-curve offered a workaround until the issue is addressed. My contribution was:
•
"Right click that focal length button in the Shift + F7 Properties and set up one f-curve, then in the Shift + F6 Graph Editor, set up your desired lens shift (vertical scale) vs time (horizontal scale). You could have a wide angle 15mm & 150mm telephoto on just 2 frames, (flipping between them with the arrow keys); or have a whole focal length transition that you play forwards ( Alt + A ) or backwards ( Shift + Alt + A ). Difficult to stop that 2nd setup looping though.
•
It's fun to watch the (real) camera contorting lengthwise through one of the virtual cameras ( Numpad 1 , Numpad 3 , Numpad 7 etc). It's also useful for controlling the size of the fly-mode 'dock', which has a freekish dependence on the active real camera's focal length."

A question on Stack Exchange ( https://blender.stackexchange.com/questions/76076/interactively-change-cameras-focal-length/76120#76120 ) made me realize that animating the real camera's focal length with an f-curve offered a workaround until the issue is addressed. My contribution was: • "Right click that focal length button in the Shift + F7 Properties and set up one f-curve, then in the Shift + F6 Graph Editor, set up your desired lens shift (vertical scale) vs time (horizontal scale). You could have a wide angle 15mm & 150mm telephoto on just 2 frames, (flipping between them with the arrow keys); or have a whole focal length transition that you play forwards ( Alt + A ) or backwards ( Shift + Alt + A ). Difficult to stop that 2nd setup looping though. • It's fun to watch the (real) camera contorting lengthwise through one of the virtual cameras ( Numpad 1 , Numpad 3 , Numpad 7 etc). It's also useful for controlling the size of the fly-mode 'dock', which has a freekish dependence on the active real camera's focal length."

blender-admin commented

2018-12-04 22:36:37 +01:00

This issue was referenced by 45c11c1a1b

This issue was referenced by 45c11c1a1bd07cca255abdb1923e69f0242c36fd

Campbell Barton commented

2018-12-04 22:40:39 +01:00

Changed status from 'Open' to: 'Resolved'

Campbell Barton closed this issue

2018-12-04 22:40:39 +01:00

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Viewport camera and Flying mode issue #49624