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SmartF easy fast tool for making faces Blender 2.8
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Full description you can see here:

https://youtu.be/WFC8UvY-9Hk

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Brendon Murphy (meta-androcto) triaged this task as Normal priority.

hi, noted, need to test, is there any user feedback?
I could add this into mesh extra tools, let me know.

Of course, need tests on real work. Nobody knows about it, where is i can get feedback? Need more time for that.

Mesh extra tools? OK, please add it.

hi, tested & it seems ok, not really suited to mesh extra tools.
looks like the only possible way is to merge with f2 addon & offer bool in addons preferences to choose the method the user requires.
this would be a good function if you can do,
Some hint that: in Booltools we have a checkbox in addons preferences to choose between boolean solvers.
I think this is only & most appropriate way to get this committed.
Thanks.

Hi, maybe i not understand you, but why F2 and SmartF need to merge? F2 and SmartF is standalone and need only for one function - make faces. And SmartF do it much better - for my opinion of course. But maybe you show me what is unique function in F2 wich need to merge?

@Duyun Ivan (DIV) people are used to f2 & it's behavior, I see changing the defaults in your addon can emulate f2 in many ways, but there's corner cases your addon may fail with.
That aside for now, what I would like to see is a checkbox in your panel to use standard F2 addon or to use your new functionality, with the default being the current f2 addon.
that way established users can use what they know & when they run into trouble can switch to yours & same in return. (I found where one fails the other may pick up the slack sometimes.)
I would also clean up the ui a little.
I find the addon is useful & provides new methods for face creation, if your happy to make the requested changes, I can make the update & accept the addon.
Thanks.

just to follow up quickly, SmartF uses F key, so does F2 addon, In my tests the addons worked different & I found where 1 fails the other may succeed.
as they play well together, they could be merged to have the best of both worlds, an alternative to this would be another key other than "F".
I think a merge to extend the functions of F2 with SmartF would be the best answer.

Hello friends, hello Brendon. If people use f2 that is their choise, just continue. I can not include any references in my addon on another addons, that is bad idea, because i can`t get responsibilities for these addons. What if tomorrow someone write new addon BestF - he must include checkboxes for F2 and SmartF and so on? If you don`t like SmartF or F2 or F122 or something else, just press ctrl+alt+U - and make your choise - it`s your freedom.

And F key - it`s not F2 key, it`s Blender default key for makeing face and edge. Only this reason is for using F-key in SmartF. And no matter what F2 use or some another addon(if they use F), because you can not use it in same time.

hi @Duyun Ivan (DIV)
I've tested the addon a couple of times & it's very good, I'm just trying to help sort out a couple of issues so we can add to blender.
hotkeys should not be same as other addons, so I'm trying to solve that by saying merge in f2 addon into yours.
In my tests your method of quad face creation removed a click & was very nice. however, it did create some doubles & fail changing face order & direction sometimes.
In the same tests I was switching between the f2 addon & your addon & found whilst yours was faster with more control in some cases, in other cases f2 addon correctly created faces where your addon did not.
this is why i say to merge in with f2 addon or better as it's less code, merge f2 addon into yours or use some of it's functions so we can have your fast face creation & options with the same results as the current f2 addon.
I see this as a good way to get this addon into blender 2.79 but we have very little time to do this.
If your addon does what the current f2 addon does & more, we can use your addon as an update & replacement for the f2 addon.
Your addon is really nice & we would like to see you develop it in Blender. I hope you understand I'm only trying here for a positive outcome.
thanks.

Thank for you response. SmartF used point of "Eye View"(point in yours screen) and make face nearest to that point. You must rotate and move camera to control it. And another control is mouse cursor for decision in which direction make face. Offen when you try to make face and can not - it seems like addon fails, but really - it`s bad verts. To check this you need move vert, in this case F2 not fail, because it have not angle/area controls, and it create new fouth vert. If you need this behaviour, just switch off angle control and area control in SmartF and choose square. In triangle mode SmarF don`t create new vert. Anyway, I think it`s not good, but if you wish i can make checkbox in SmarF panel like "Switch to F2" and copy/paste F2 code in function under SmartF. OK, I will send new code for you soon.

@Duyun Ivan (DIV)
Please when you upload the new version, can use some pep8 style checker like flake8?
Some basic style guide for Blender inclusion:
4 spaces indentation, 2 lines skipped between different functions/classes blocks, spaces around operators, no spaces between equals in parameters assignment, lines must be max 120 chars long.
https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:Py/Scripts/Guidelines/Addons

Thanks.

Hello everybody. Here is new version with F2 support. Vuk you absolutely rigth, but i don`t have time for this at this moment. Maybe after few days. (where is pyfmt like gofmt :( ).

hi, could add this to contrib shortly, would need the pep8 clean up first

Hello. SmartF with pep8 standart.

hi, sorry for delays, will add to contrib shortly and work from there as future replacement for f2 addon
have you tested this in 2.79 and nightly builds?

Hi. Yes, I am tested it in 2.79 - all work fine.

Just found this amazing tool while searching for F2 alternatives.
But it lacked a port to 2.80, so i did it.

I tried to test every feature, but maybe i missed something.
Let me know if there's anything wrong.

Made some changes to F2 code so it's the same as official.
Moved the addon panel to the right menu with it's own tab.
Minor corrections on descriptions and comments.

Updated F2 addon included in SmartF with latest changes.

Brendon Murphy (meta-androcto) renamed this task from SmartF easy and fast tool for making faces to SmartF easy fast tool for making faces Blender 2.8.Feb 15 2019, 1:59 AM

Updated addon to work with latest API changes.

Thank you. I'll find time to test. Are you prepared to maintain this long term?

Yes, i'm ready to maintain this addon long term, at least with API changes and fixes.

Brendon Murphy (meta-androcto) raised the priority of this task from Normal to Confirmed, Medium.

hi, thanks very much, Can you please check with nightly builds to make sure code is working correctly, I don't see any issue, but it's worth regular checking.
Have you looked at https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Tools/Git and https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Developer_Intro/Overview ? Are you prepared to maintain the addon within Blender through the 2.8 series? Let me know so we can look at your access to the addons repository.
There could be a couple more things to do here. I've had discussion with @Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc) and he's still advocating the f2 addon. Given it's included in smartf we maybe could address the issue further.

The panel tab needs to be "Edit", panel name should be SmartF
In the addons preferences are these defaults the same as in current f2 behavior? If not maybe off by default?
Also, can we change the switch around so f2 is the default start up please? I think this solves some issues.
If f2 is the default and the panel switch is in both the ui and the addons preferences, we should be right.
Finally, I think we must replace the current f2 code with the smartf code and "update f2 to include smartf".
I think this allows for external and commercial addons that may call the f2 functions to continue operating as expected.

a small thing:

from bpy.props import *

needs to name the props imported, addons should do this and it's an easy fix.

Thanks, this task has been around too long, it would be nice to see it resolved.

Hi there. Thanks for inviting.

In the addons preferences are these defaults the same as in current f2 behavior? If not maybe off by default?

F2 defaults are changed. Suddenly it is incredibly hard to put proper version into b3d, so latest version can be obtained here both for 2.79 and 2.8 versions.
https://github.com/Cfyzzz/Other-scripts

Finally, I think we must replace the current f2 code with the smartf code and "update f2 to include smartf".

I am not entirely sure about that.
The problem is that the most of problems that are fixed by smartf are mostly not exist.
Basically, F2 gives full control and flexibility over creating faces, and it is main goal - to provide the most flexible organic workflow.
It never "mistakes", it never creates "fake faces", user does.
You can easily mess up with extrude or spin tool, but this is not their problem - their only goal is to provide the most flexible functionality at your service.

he's still advocating the f2 addon

As you can remember, F2 is hard tested for every possible workflow issue, to make sure it provides full control and flexibility even without prefrences.
https://youtu.be/Tsaa_D6CcSo

Entire triply diamond turbosquid account were made during it's test
https://www.turbosquid.com/Search/Artists/1d_inc

I can't say that there are no things I would like to fix in F2 (like backward face creating lock) but current smartf realization damages workflow.
Conflict is that SmartF is designed to create accurate faces, while F2 was designed to create complex organic quads only models with maximum speed and flexibility, so everything is needed to be carefully tested for workflow compartibility and speed before any serious movements like code replacing.

I am ready for your questions about F2 workflow, in order to explain why some things are done the way they are done,
but first I need to know what you are making using it.

hi @Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc),
Thank you for your detailed response, we appreciate your time and input on this. I consider you the expert on the f2 addon functionality.

F2 defaults are changed. Suddenly it is incredibly hard to put proper version into b3d, so latest version can be obtained here both for 2.79 and 2.8 versions.
https://github.com/Cfyzzz/Other-scripts

Is this the F2 version you need in 2.8 release? We can do this easily. Does Cfyzzz want to maintain it in the Blender repo? Or yourself? I could add it as an update for you but we prefer for the new Authors/maintainers to be accountable for their own addons. Please let us know how you wish to proceed.

I am not entirely sure about that.
The problem is that the most of problems that are fixed by smartf are mostly not exist.
Basically, F2 gives full control and flexibility over creating faces, and it is main goal - to provide the most flexible organic workflow.
It never "mistakes", it never creates "fake faces", user does.
You can easily mess up with extrude or spin tool, but this is not their problem - their only goal is to provide the most flexible functionality at your service.

I'm looking for a solution here, we could, with some changes possibly still make this work or decide that smartf is better left as an external addon. My opinion was based that F2 had no active maintainer (but always updated to work) and SmartF kept getting updated so people must value it too.

My final attempt would be to separate the scripts into 2 files again so f2 is manageable alone, then run them in a folder "mesh_f2" under an init. Users seem to appreciate both addons?
The default would be f2 from Cfyzzz. No extra options in the Addons Preferences so there's no mistake. SmartF would create it's own panel as it does now. The panel would show that F2 is the active tool and provide a switch to use SmartF and activate it's ui/functions. SmartF mode panel of course would have the switch back to F2. This would effectively leave things as they are for F2 users and allow SmartF users to use their method optionally.

Thanks again for your time.

@CansecoGPC (CansecoGPC) Can we have your opinion here too?

hi, thanks very much, Can you please check with nightly builds to make sure code is working correctly, I don't see any issue, but it's worth regular checking.
Have you looked at https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Tools/Git and https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Developer_Intro/Overview ? Are you prepared to maintain the addon within Blender through the 2.8 series? Let me know so we can look at your access to the addons repository.

I would take a look, and yes i'm ready, but not much time lately.

There could be a couple more things to do here. I've had discussion with @Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc) and he's still advocating the f2 addon. Given it's included in smartf we maybe could address the issue further.

Maybe it would be better to have them separated, becuase if SmartF has a bug it could affect the F2 part.

The panel tab needs to be "Edit", panel name should be SmartF

Going to change that soon.

a small thing:

from bpy.props import *

needs to name the props imported, addons should do this and it's an easy fix.

Thx, will fix ASAP.

Thanks, this task has been around too long, it would be nice to see it resolved.

I agree.

Changed Panel from it's own tab to Edit and panel name to SmartF.
Only call prop imports needed.

I could add it as an update for you but we prefer for the new Authors/maintainers to be accountable for their own addons. Please let us know how you wish to proceed.

As CG workflow desiger, I am an author of concept of F2 tool. I work with different local python developers, ordering different concepts of tools to them, so development of F2 is under my maintain, but was written by several developers.
Yes, I would like it to be updated from Cfyzzz Github (at least once since, probably, 2014). That would be awesome.
F2 2.8 version

About keeping SmartF and F2 simultaneously and separated - it seems to be the best solution, as far as they have different binding to the workflow and maintainers/developers.
Currently we are making same thing for snaping tools - we making strong fork from beauty one. Same concept, different realizations.

Maybe it would be better to have them separated

Very good and smart idea. I told about this at begining of SmartF. No need to keep F2 and SmartF together.

The issue is/was: It's difficult to justify 2 addons that do essentially the same function being in Blender. Both addons have a user base, both can useful in different situations and provide elements each other does not. They also use the same hotkey so there's the potential for key map issues.
As we need to solve this I think the only way is this.
1/ Update F2 to the version here: https://github.com/Cfyzzz/Other-scripts/blob/master/f2%2028%201-8-4.py
2/ Add SmartF as provided by @CansecoGPC (CansecoGPC) with a warning not to enable F2 addon

@CansecoGPC (CansecoGPC) As your addon contains F2 but a different version and you've done a lot of work. We can keep your addon as is. It's good to change the class names slightly so both addons are really separate. We could call the version of F2 you use "F2 Legacy Mode" and keep the work you have done already. It will be then up to users to decide which methods best suit their workflow and which addon to enable.

If everyone is happy with this, we can move forward.

I has got two questions - does SmartF have user base, and what situations it is useful.

The problem is that we are not familiar to each other.
Well, I guess you know me a bit, I am CG workflow designer, me and thousants of my students uses F2 daily, and my work is so hard, that baroque quad modeling is my hobby (that's why I made it the main source of donations).
I use F2 for both organic and CAD modeling, as far as I'm an architect, so I used to think that I've seen all cases possible, because I practice daily through several years, including modeling classic decor, modern decor, architectural buildings, historic restorations, cars, peoples, animals, and even negative gaussian curvature triply periodic minimal surfaces.

But I can not imagine a single case that would clearly depict the superiority of SmartF.
(Filling regular checker? ... I can't remember any case I ever need it, but even thou it can be easily filled it with F2 in edge mode)
So this is a big issue for me as CG workflow designer, maybe your work is even harder than mine, and I missing something.
Can you please provide some using cases, final products, that clearly shows that all this stuff like prefrences is really necessary?

For example, this is how workflow research looks like - a timelapse video of the process of building a real complex model is performed for further analysis.
This allows to check the effectiveness of the methods and concepts used in the production at entire workflow scale.
At the moment, entire model can be made without any kind of panels and prefrences, also there are almost no errors, no misclickings, no fake faces, no checker fillings... workflow is clean, straightforward and smooth.
So what is the problem that you want to solve?

https://youtu.be/KneLJk3-J7U

@Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc) points taken. I'm just trying to solve this task and try to keep the addons repo up to date. I'm not an expert modeller, so my tests are basic.
Now that I know of the new F2 version I'll have to address that. I will create another task for F2 addon.
@CansecoGPC (CansecoGPC) @Duyun Ivan (DIV) sorry, this is on hold again. it's up to you guys to decide how you want to proceed. Can you address some of the issues raised by 1D_Inc?
I did think with the panel it offered on the fly options, which is good for users who might just be learning what the options do, or occasionally use the tool.
Are the issues that led to the writing of Smartf addressed in the new version of f2?
Which functions in Smartf differ from f2? If it's only a matter of adding a couple of new functions and an ui to f2 now?
Let me know what you think and would like to see happen.

Brendon Murphy (meta-androcto) lowered the priority of this task from Confirmed, Medium to Normal.Jun 17 2019, 2:16 AM

Personally, from entire SmartF I mostly like "lock of backwards fake faces"
https://youtu.be/WFC8UvY-9Hk?t=348
I was planning to make such lock, but at workflow scale it suddenly was not disturbing or harmful enough, so it was left until better times, and more urgent scripts took priority.
Maybe we will do it once.

I can't address @Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc) issues because making things with Blender is just a hobby for me.
I just saw an addon that needed to be updated, didn't read the conversation about being the substitute for F2.
It would be great to have both, but i guess you want to have the only minimum necesary addons, so there can only be one?

Well, yes, that's one of actual problems in CG Workflow design.
Usability is not equal to strong math, but strong math can be reached more easily.

I want to share a story when I came across this for the first time.

A long time ago, in 2012 Bsurfaces were released as GPL
I was impressed with it's functionality in organic modeling, so I've tried it and understood that it is incredibly hard using it even to reproduce models from video.
Concept I made after that was very simple - I would like to give Bsurfaces ability not to only create, but also edit geometry.
So I've come to Bartius Crouch and ask him to write the most beautiful addon, as I thought at that moment - Gstretch.
Now it still can be found in LoopTools

I've spent hundreds USD on it's development during overall process, testing it's functionality, but after all I figured out, that it fits mostly regular geometry, so I asked Bartius to write a little helper - short spider-script (for about 60eur), that would help me a bit with topology sketching during testing Gstretch.
As you can already understand, this was the birth of F2.

So, after all this years this little simple cheap script turned out to be a real discovery, that we are using daily.
Using it I fill turbosquid account with baroque models and became Diamond Blenderfund donator,
while main expensive script that I've come for - Gstretch (and his his ancestor Bsurfaces) - turned out to be almost useless, and I don't use it even once a year.

That's the story)
After that I've decided to make proper workflow compartibility tests, because, as it turned out, workflow declares main profits in a very unobvious way.

hi @Paul Kotelevets (1D_Inc), great story, Thanks, it gives me a greater understanding of your F2. I have similar stories from the old days and the new. Bart is a great guy, he helped me with addons in the very beginning, donating much time to Blender.
In the case of SmartF I was also looking for a maintainer as I was unaware of your F2 updates and continued maintenance. I'm always on the lookout for active developers, especially during big changes like 2.8.
Addons like bsurfaces, f2, looptools, mesh edit tools content, all date back some years, it's a testament to their usefulness that they always get attention at the right times.

Closing this task as archived. We can look at reusing any functions from smartf into f2 in the f2 task T65867 at a later time.

p.s. If it is interesting, I made research about where checkers can be actually useful.
Here is Canasta video.

However, it still can be solved with default F2 with almost no losses.
That's one of the problem of F2 updates - I still trying to find a shape that cannot be or will be hard to be done with F2 to find out its critical issues in practice, but still no succed.
Will try further.

https://youtu.be/Nk5fdIVPBLY

ok I tried it and it didn't even deserve D as key...F2 will survive to this...