New Bevel: Scaling Vertices, Edges by their individual origins has different behavior if bevel regions are direct neighbors (selection flushing to edges immediately?) #73771

New Issue

Zino Guerr · 2020-02-13T05:30:31+01:00

Zino Guerr commented

2020-02-13 05:30:31 +01:00

System Information
Operating system: Windows-10-10.0.14393 64 Bits
Graphics card: GeForce GTX 1050 Ti/PCIe/SSE2 NVIDIA Corporation 4.5.0 NVIDIA 436.30

Blender Version
Broken: version: 2.83 (sub 2), branch: master, commit date: 2020-02-13 02:55, hash: f874f6817d
Worked: (optional)

Short description of error

Scaling Vertices and Edges no longer work when the pivot point is set to "individual origins".
If you start by scaling the vertices then same issue when you switch to Edges but if you start with Faces then scaling the edges suddenly work.

Scaling Vertices is always broken no matter the order.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error

Factory Setting with the default keymap.
Open the file which has everything setup, Vertices selected and the pivot point set to individual origins.
Hit S for scaling.
Switch to Edge mode.
Hit S, same issue.
Switch to Face mode.
Hit S, now it works.
Switch Back to Edge mode.
Hit S, Edge mode now works.
Switch to Vertex mode.
#It won't work, if you go by order back and forth then Edge mode works depending on which previous mode was set before it.
PS: it seems also happening for other Transform modes, it's not just Scale :)

Credit to Jan van den Hemel for showing the trick .
https://twitter.com/JanvandenHemel/status/1227644588309065732

[Please describe the exact steps needed to reproduce the issue]
[Based on the default startup or an attached .blend file (as simple as possible)]
Scale_Indv_Bug.blend

**System Information** Operating system: Windows-10-10.0.14393 64 Bits Graphics card: GeForce GTX 1050 Ti/PCIe/SSE2 NVIDIA Corporation 4.5.0 NVIDIA 436.30 **Blender Version** Broken: version: 2.83 (sub 2), branch: master, commit date: 2020-02-13 02:55, hash: `f874f6817d` Worked: (optional) **Short description of error** Scaling Vertices and Edges no longer work when the pivot point is set to "individual origins". If you start by scaling the vertices then same issue when you switch to Edges but if you start with Faces then scaling the edges suddenly work. Scaling Vertices is always broken no matter the order. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** - Factory Setting with the default keymap. - Open the file which has everything setup, Vertices selected and the pivot point set to individual origins. - Hit S for scaling. - Switch to Edge mode. - Hit S, same issue. - Switch to Face mode. - Hit S, now it works. - Switch Back to Edge mode. - Hit S, Edge mode now works. - Switch to Vertex mode. #It won't work, if you go by order back and forth then Edge mode works depending on which previous mode was set before it. PS: it seems also happening for other Transform modes, it's not just Scale :) Credit to **Jan van den Hemel** for showing the trick . https://twitter.com/JanvandenHemel/status/1227644588309065732 [Please describe the exact steps needed to reproduce the issue] [Based on the default startup or an attached .blend file (as simple as possible)] [Scale_Indv_Bug.blend](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8337378/Scale_Indv_Bug.blend)

Zino Guerr commented

2020-02-13 05:30:31 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Znio.G

blender-admin commented

2020-02-13 05:30:31 +01:00

#83075 was marked as duplicate of this issue

Stanislav Blinov commented

2020-02-13 08:15:54 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Stan_Pancakes

Stanislav Blinov commented

2020-02-13 08:15:54 +01:00

This is not a bug. It is a (perhaps slightly unfortunate) consequence of Blender's selection propagation. When you're in Vertex mode, you have a fully contiguous selection: edges between the circles are also selected. Since it is contiguous, there's only one "origin", therefore the selection is transformed as a whole. When you switch from Vertex to Edge mode, that edge selection is preserved, so you again have contiguous selection. It is when you switch to Face mode the selection becomes disjoint, and each selected "island" has its own "individual origin" for transform.

Zino Guerr commented

2020-02-13 08:41:19 +01:00

@Stan_Pancakes But it worked in previous versions though! if you bevel a row of vertices and scale them on their "individual origin" in 2.80 or 2.81 works, in the master branch even when extruding includes that contiguous edge where before it wasn't that case.

Here is a 2.81 Demo.

@Stan_Pancakes But it worked in previous versions though! if you bevel a row of vertices and scale them on their "individual origin" in 2.80 or 2.81 works, in the master branch even when extruding includes that contiguous edge where before it wasn't that case. Here is a 2.81 Demo. ![2.81.gif](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8337515/2.81.gif)

Stanislav Blinov commented

2020-02-13 08:46:00 +01:00

That which you show in that example, I believe, is actually a bug. When you bevel the vertices like this, the selection readout at the bottom right will state that 20 edges are selected, where in fact there are (should be) 24. If, after such bevel, you switch to edge mode and back to vertex mode, then all 24 edges will be selected, and the behavior would revert to transforming the whole selection.

Philipp Oeser commented

2020-02-13 12:07:41 +01:00

Added subscribers: @HooglyBoogly, @lichtwerk

Philipp Oeser commented

2020-02-13 12:07:41 +01:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Needs Developer To Reproduce'

Philipp Oeser commented

2020-02-13 12:07:41 +01:00

Looks like the "old" bevel wasnt flushing selection to edges immediately, whereas the "new" bevel is...
@HooglyBoogly : can you confirm?

In the usecase described here, the "old" way actually has benefits, not sure though if we can call this a bug (it might be needed even for "new" bevel -- and in a way is actually more "correct" to flush immediately)
Tough call, but I would vote for this not being a bug, the workaround switching modes (face-mode is your friend here)

@HooglyBoogly : would you take the burden to decide whether to close this or not? [like I said, got my vote for closing...]

Looks like the "old" bevel wasnt flushing selection to edges immediately, whereas the "new" bevel is... @HooglyBoogly : can you confirm? In the usecase described here, the "old" way actually has benefits, not sure though if we can call this a bug (it might be needed even for "new" bevel -- and in a way is actually more "correct" to flush immediately) Tough call, but I would vote for this not being a bug, the workaround switching modes (face-mode is your friend here) @HooglyBoogly : would you take the burden to decide whether to close this or not? [like I said, got my vote for closing...]

Philipp Oeser changed title from ~~Bug Scaling Vertices, Edges by their individual origins.~~ to New Bevel: Scaling Vertices, Edges by their individual origins has different behavior if bevel regions are direct neighbors (selection flushing to edges immediately?)

2020-02-13 12:09:46 +01:00

Hans Goudey commented

2020-02-13 18:11:25 +01:00

Added subscriber: @ideasman42

Hans Goudey commented

2020-02-13 18:11:26 +01:00

I believe this behavior is related to one of these two commits by @ideasman42:

133f6a9812
f164ea6eaa
I'm traveling right now but when I get back to my computer I can look at it. Thanks for letting me know. I agree it doesn't exactly look like a bug.

I believe this behavior is related to one of these two commits by @ideasman42: 1. 133f6a9812 2. f164ea6eaa I'm traveling right now but when I get back to my computer I can look at it. Thanks for letting me know. I agree it doesn't exactly look like a bug.

Stanislav Blinov commented

2020-02-13 21:13:54 +01:00

While the old way may indeed have accidental "benefits", tools really, really should not create invalid selection state. https://docs.blender.org/api/current/bmesh.html#keeping-a-correct-state

While the old way may indeed have accidental "benefits", tools really, **really** should not create invalid selection state. https://docs.blender.org/api/current/bmesh.html#keeping-a-correct-state

Hans Goudey commented

2020-02-14 23:34:38 +01:00

Changed status from 'Needs Developer To Reproduce' to: 'Archived'

Hans Goudey closed this issue

2020-02-14 23:34:38 +01:00

Hans Goudey self-assigned this 2020-02-14 23:34:38 +01:00

Hans Goudey commented

2020-02-14 23:34:38 +01:00

This isn't a bug, and it's actually a bug fix that caused this change. There shouldn't be "individual origins" because all of the vertices are connected by at most one edge.

The technique you brought up still works, just use a different bevel offset to change the size of the holes rather than scaling them. That said, the profile value of 0.1 doesn't create a circle, 0.088 is closer, but the way bevel is coded means you shouldn't rely on the profile to be perfectly circular.

Thanks for the report anyway.

This isn't a bug, and it's actually a bug fix that caused this change. There shouldn't be "individual origins" because all of the vertices are connected by at most one edge. The technique you brought up still works, just use a different bevel offset to change the size of the holes rather than scaling them. That said, the profile value of 0.1 doesn't create a circle, 0.088 is closer, but the way bevel is coded means you shouldn't rely on the profile to be perfectly circular. Thanks for the report anyway.

Zino Guerr commented

2020-02-15 09:49:01 +01:00

In #73771#871952, @HooglyBoogly wrote:
This isn't a bug, and it's actually a bug fix that caused this change. There shouldn't be "individual origins" because all of the vertices are connected by at most one edge.

The technique you brought up still works, just use a different bevel offset to change the size of the holes rather than scaling them. That said, the profile value of 0.1 doesn't create a circle, 0.088 is closer, but the way bevel is coded means you shouldn't rely on the profile to be perfectly circular.

Thanks for the report anyway.

Thanks, i guess the issue goes back to 2.7x versions or even before.
I didn't know that it was a bug to be honest, i thought this is how it always worked because how Blender handles meshes differently from what i used to see in the other apps, but since the new changes fixe a long time bug then no problem, we can use other ways to get the same result.

> In #73771#871952, @HooglyBoogly wrote: > This isn't a bug, and it's actually a bug fix that caused this change. There shouldn't be "individual origins" because all of the vertices are connected by at most one edge. > > The technique you brought up still works, just use a different bevel offset to change the size of the holes rather than scaling them. That said, the profile value of 0.1 doesn't create a circle, 0.088 is closer, but the way bevel is coded means you shouldn't rely on the profile to be perfectly circular. > > Thanks for the report anyway. Thanks, i guess the issue goes back to 2.7x versions or even before. I didn't know that it was a bug to be honest, i thought this is how it always worked because how Blender handles meshes differently from what i used to see in the other apps, but since the new changes fixe a long time bug then no problem, we can use other ways to get the same result.

Philipp Oeser commented

2020-11-27 10:25:47 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Paladinqp

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New Bevel: Scaling Vertices, Edges by their individual origins has different behavior if bevel regions are direct neighbors (selection flushing to edges immediately?) #73771