"Paste Objects" doesn't copy source objects' collection heirarchy #76246

New Issue

Carlo Andreacchio · 2020-04-30T01:37:29+02:00

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-04-30 01:37:29 +02:00

Starting to switch over to Blender 2.8 / 2.9, copy pasting still isnt working as intended. Please see #58190 as a reference of the previous bug.

System Information
Operating system: Ubuntu 17.10
Graphics card: GTX 1080

Blender Version
Broken: blender2.9 55a2682348
Worked: master Oct 2018 786870e26f

Short description of error
Copy pasting between blend files, it does not honor the collection hierarchy, Previously with blender 2.7 we could disable 'Active Layer' and the objects would go to their correct respective layers from the original blend file. Now with Blender 2.8 the only option is to have the copy paste on to the active collection, ruining any sort of collection hierarchy that was previously setup.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error

Open Blender 2.8
create a new collection called 'test'
move the cube into this the collection 'test'
copy collection 'test'
create new blend file
delete everything apart from the default collection 'Collection'
create new collection 'test'
make the active collection the default collection 'Collection'
Paste
in the 'Paste Selection from Buffer' dialogue box, disable active collection
notice how the cube just created a new collection altogether, rather than creating the correct collection name / merging into it.

Starting to switch over to Blender 2.8 / 2.9, copy pasting still isnt working as intended. Please see #58190 as a reference of the previous bug. System Information Operating system: Ubuntu 17.10 Graphics card: GTX 1080 Blender Version Broken: blender2.9 55a2682348 Worked: master Oct 2018 786870e26f Short description of error Copy pasting between blend files, it does not honor the collection hierarchy, Previously with blender 2.7 we could disable 'Active Layer' and the objects would go to their correct respective layers from the original blend file. Now with Blender 2.8 the only option is to have the copy paste on to the active collection, ruining any sort of collection hierarchy that was previously setup. Exact steps for others to reproduce the error - Open Blender 2.8 - create a new collection called 'test' - move the cube into this the collection 'test' - copy collection 'test' - create new blend file - delete everything apart from the default collection 'Collection' - create new collection 'test' - make the active collection the default collection 'Collection' - Paste - in the 'Paste Selection from Buffer' dialogue box, disable active collection - notice how the cube just created a new collection altogether, rather than creating the correct collection name / merging into it.

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-04-30 01:37:29 +02:00

Added subscriber: @candreacchio

Richard Antalik commented

2020-05-04 09:21:50 +02:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-05-21 07:15:23 +02:00

Hey guys, i know theres lots on, just wondering if this is being targetted for the 2.83 release or the 2.9 release?

Thanks

Carlo

Hey guys, i know theres lots on, just wondering if this is being targetted for the 2.83 release or the 2.9 release? Thanks Carlo

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-06-03 11:07:38 +02:00

I guess its not on the page for 2.83 then. Can i get a confirmation that this is going to be part of 2.9?

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-07-29 09:25:29 +02:00

Its been a few months since there has been any update, Is this assigned to any module owner?

Carlo

Its been a few months since there has been any update, Is this assigned to any module owner? Carlo

Hans Goudey commented

2020-09-08 21:16:54 +02:00

Added subscriber: @HooglyBoogly

Hans Goudey commented

2020-09-08 21:16:54 +02:00

Thanks for the report Carlo, sorry it took so long for a response.

It's too bad this functionality was lost with the transition to collections. This report verges a bit on a feature request though, since the code is working as intended. However, since it's a regression in functionality from 2.79, I'll mark it as a known issue.

It's not that the "Active Collection" toggle doesn't work, it's just that it does a different thing in 2.8, it controls putting the objects in a new collection vs the active collection.

Using "Append" from the file menu can mostly get you what you want, although of course it will append all the objects in a collection instead of just the selected objects.

Thanks for the report Carlo, sorry it took so long for a response. It's too bad this functionality was lost with the transition to collections. This report verges a bit on a feature request though, since the code is working as intended. However, since it's a regression in functionality from 2.79, I'll mark it as a known issue. It's not that the "Active Collection" toggle doesn't work, it's just that it does a different thing in 2.8, it controls putting the objects in a new collection vs the active collection. Using "Append" from the file menu can mostly get you what you want, although of course it will append all the objects in a collection instead of just the selected objects.

Hans Goudey changed title from ~~Paste selection from buffer - Disabling 'Active Collection' doesnt work~~ to "Paste Objects" doesn't copy source objects' collection heirarchy

2020-09-08 21:18:01 +02:00

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-09-09 02:52:47 +02:00

Thanks for the update @HooglyBoogly ,

The Copy / Paste functionality is ideal for working in large scenes split up across many artists. This bug is pretty much the main reason why we have not updated to 2.8/2.9 yet.

I tried digging around in the code about 2 weeks ago and couldnt really understand how the copy buffer worked, I may just end up coding my own solution in the iterium through python.

Thanks for the confirmation though.

Thanks for the update @HooglyBoogly , The Copy / Paste functionality is ideal for working in large scenes split up across many artists. This bug is pretty much the main reason why we have not updated to 2.8/2.9 yet. I tried digging around in the code about 2 weeks ago and couldnt really understand how the copy buffer worked, I may just end up coding my own solution in the iterium through python. Thanks for the confirmation though.

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2020-10-08 01:45:23 +02:00

Hi All,

It has been another month, any update on this bug?

Thanks

Carlo

Hi All, It has been another month, any update on this bug? Thanks Carlo

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-01-04 05:57:12 +01:00

Hi all, its been another few months and just reaching out to see if there is anyone tackling this issue yet?

Thanks

Carlo

Hi all, its been another few months and just reaching out to see if there is anyone tackling this issue yet? Thanks Carlo

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-02-15 05:42:59 +01:00

Hey all, just checking in, its been about 6 months since the last reply. Is anyone going to tackle this workflow issue?

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-03-11 07:27:18 +01:00

And another month has gone by without any comment. Is anyone looking into this at all? has it been put on anyones todo list?

Hans Goudey commented

2021-03-11 16:13:23 +01:00

Hi @candreacchio, anyone is free to work on this task, but just because it is in the tracker here does not mean someone will necessarily be scheduled to work on it. That's why it's classified as a "Known Issue" here.

I hope you understand there are lots of other priorities, bugs to fix, other workflows to improve, etc, and in general comments here should not be used to "bump" tasks.

Hi @candreacchio, anyone is free to work on this task, but just because it is in the tracker here does not mean someone will necessarily be scheduled to work on it. That's why it's classified as a "Known Issue" here. I hope you understand there are lots of other priorities, bugs to fix, other workflows to improve, etc, and in general comments here should not be used to "bump" tasks.

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-04-29 10:13:24 +02:00

Hi @HooglyBoogly

Is it usual for To-Do's and Known Issues to sit idle for years? Is there any plan on tackling the older issues?

Thanks

Carlo

Hi @HooglyBoogly Is it usual for To-Do's and Known Issues to sit idle for years? Is there any plan on tackling the older issues? Thanks Carlo

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-06-17 09:43:09 +02:00

I wonder if this is a To-Do for blender 3?

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2021-09-18 04:00:02 +02:00

Any word on if this will make it in for Blender 3?

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2022-03-04 02:02:30 +01:00

Hey @HooglyBoogly , Its been nearly a year since you last responded to me, nearly 2 years since I opened this task. Is this ever going to get done? I understand that its classified as a 'Known Issue' and that it may not have anyone scheduled for it. But as it is a known issue, it should be tackled at some stage?

Thanks

Carlo

Hey @HooglyBoogly , Its been nearly a year since you last responded to me, nearly 2 years since I opened this task. Is this ever going to get done? I understand that its classified as a 'Known Issue' and that it may not have anyone scheduled for it. But as it is a known issue, it should be tackled at some stage? Thanks Carlo

Mike Drake commented

2022-03-04 03:32:24 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Michael-Drake

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2022-07-25 19:28:11 +02:00

Added subscriber: @LucianoMunoz

xan2622 commented

2022-07-25 19:32:15 +02:00

Added subscriber: @xan2622

Stig Oskar commented

2022-07-25 20:02:00 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Stinaus

Hans Goudey commented

2022-07-25 20:53:33 +02:00

Adding the #Core module here, since copy and paste of objects and collections seems like it fits there-- it's not just a UI issue.

Fin O'Riordan commented

2022-07-25 21:47:15 +02:00

Added subscriber: @FinbarrORiordan

Daniel Gryningstjerna commented

2022-07-25 22:09:07 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Dangry

Andy Cuccaro commented

2022-07-26 03:29:45 +02:00

Added subscriber: @AndyCuccaro

Bastien Montagne commented

2022-07-26 09:39:54 +02:00

Added subscribers: @dfelinto, @mont29

Bastien Montagne commented

2022-07-26 09:39:54 +02:00

It is indeed not an UI issue, and it is not a bug either, not a regression, and not even a known issue. It's simply a consequence of the change from layers to collections/viewlayers system. Preserving 1-1 features between 2.7x and 2.8x was never an enforced goal, there were many breaking changes between those series.

Now while I can see how nice it would be to be able to preserve a collection hierarchy when copy/pasting an object, this is simply impossible with current design. Unlike layers (which where stored as part of object data), collections are completely different IDs, and view layers are stored elsewhere too (in Scene IDs). Copy paste (which relies under the hood on saving a temp blend file, and appending from it) currently has no way to provide such behavior, and implementing it would not be a simple task. We would probably need a dedicated complex operation on top of the regular copy/paste code.

From a UX perspective, there are also issues, like how to deal with an object belonging to many different collection hierarchies? Should the whole tree of those be rebuilt on paste? What if it is in several different top-level collections in the current view layer? How to deal with an already existing hierarchy of collections? etc.

Personally I would try to find another workflow, rather than trying to force a tool (copy/paste) to do what it was not designed to do.

But would also like to have @dfelinto view on this topic?

It is indeed not an UI issue, and it is not a bug either, not a regression, and not even a known issue. It's simply a consequence of the change from layers to collections/viewlayers system. Preserving 1-1 features between 2.7x and 2.8x was never an enforced goal, there were many breaking changes between those series. Now while I can see how nice it would be to be able to preserve a collection hierarchy when copy/pasting an object, this is simply impossible with current design. Unlike layers (which where stored as part of object data), collections are completely different IDs, and view layers are stored elsewhere too (in Scene IDs). Copy paste (which relies under the hood on saving a temp blend file, and appending from it) currently has no way to provide such behavior, and implementing it would not be a simple task. We would probably need a dedicated complex operation on top of the regular copy/paste code. From a UX perspective, there are also issues, like how to deal with an object belonging to many different collection hierarchies? Should the whole tree of those be rebuilt on paste? What if it is in several different top-level collections in the current view layer? How to deal with an already existing hierarchy of collections? etc. Personally I would try to find another workflow, rather than trying to force a tool (copy/paste) to do what it was not designed to do. But would also like to have @dfelinto view on this topic?

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-26 10:14:08 +02:00

Changed status from 'Confirmed' to: 'Archived'

Dalai Felinto closed this issue

2022-07-26 10:14:08 +02:00

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-26 10:14:08 +02:00

Added subscriber: @brecht

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-26 10:14:08 +02:00

Maybe @brecht sees it differently, but I don't think the old behaviour is compatible with the current collection design.

While before the layer was a property of the object itself, right now the collection is part of the scene organization, and the object is a part of it (not owning it).

I'm closing this as archived since it is not planned to be changed.

Maybe @brecht sees it differently, but I don't think the old behaviour is compatible with the current collection design. While before the layer was a property of the object itself, right now the collection is part of the scene organization, and the object is a part of it (not owning it). I'm closing this as archived since it is not planned to be changed.

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-26 10:22:15 +02:00

Just for the records, what someone could do is to implement a Copy/Paste for full collections. But it is different than what this task was about.

Carlo Andreacchio commented

2022-07-26 10:35:39 +02:00

@mont29 It definetly is possible as we have developed our own internal Python Scripts to essentially do what was previously done. Yes its a bit of a hacky way around it and it would be great to actually get this implemented.

I would like to disagree on whether this is a regression or not. It is a regression. It definetly effects artists workflow in a worse way. Knowing that your copy / paste is going to the same collection layouts helps keep scene organisation and limits mistakes.

@dfelinto I would like you to re-think about closing this as it definetly is a step back compared to blender 2.79.

@mont29 It definetly is possible as we have developed our own internal Python Scripts to essentially do what was previously done. Yes its a bit of a hacky way around it and it would be great to actually get this implemented. I would like to disagree on whether this is a regression or not. It is a regression. It definetly effects artists workflow in a worse way. Knowing that your copy / paste is going to the same collection layouts helps keep scene organisation and limits mistakes. @dfelinto I would like you to re-think about closing this as it definetly is a step back compared to blender 2.79.

Brecht Van Lommel commented

2022-07-26 19:05:33 +02:00

I think it would make sense to copy over the collection hierarchy in some way, even if it's not as well defined in all cases. It just seems like the most useful behavior for users.

But it's not obvious to me what the right heuristic would be. Always copying the entire hierarchy towards the scene collection, or only a smaller subset that gets embedded in the active collection.

I think it would make sense to copy over the collection hierarchy in some way, even if it's not as well defined in all cases. It just seems like the most useful behavior for users. But it's not obvious to me what the right heuristic would be. Always copying the entire hierarchy towards the scene collection, or only a smaller subset that gets embedded in the active collection.

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2022-07-26 19:33:57 +02:00

In hopes that this can be fixed / improved this is what my approach would be:

Sample scene structure:

Scene collection
 -- character
    -- geo
       -- "my character object"
 -- environment
    -- "my environment object"

We copy "my character object" and "my environment object"

When pasting in the same scene or other I should be able to paste it 3 ways:

1: scene collection
2: maintain collection structure
3: in active collection (being the less commonly wanted)

1: Scene Collection

will just paste all the objects in the root collection to be organized manually by the user.

  Scene collection 
  -- "my character object"
  -- "my environment object"

2: Maintain Collection Structure

If said collections don't exist it will create them.

 Scene collection 
 -- character
    -- geo
        -- "my character object"
 -- environment
    -- "my environment object"

Else

 Scene collection 
 -- character
    -- geo
       -- "other objects previously in collection"
       -- "my character object"
 -- environment
    -- "other objects previously in collection"
    -- "my environment object"

3: in active collection (being the less commonly wanted)

Do the current behaviour.

thanks !

In hopes that this can be fixed / improved this is what my approach would be: Sample scene structure: ``` Scene collection -- character -- geo -- "my character object" -- environment -- "my environment object" ``` We copy "my character object" and "my environment object" When pasting in the same scene or other I should be able to paste it 3 ways: 1: scene collection 2: maintain collection structure 3: in active collection (being the less commonly wanted) **1: Scene Collection** will just paste all the objects in the root collection to be organized manually by the user. ``` Scene collection -- "my character object" -- "my environment object" ``` **2: Maintain Collection Structure** If said collections don't exist it will create them. ``` Scene collection -- character -- geo -- "my character object" -- environment -- "my environment object" ``` Else ``` Scene collection -- character -- geo -- "other objects previously in collection" -- "my character object" -- environment -- "other objects previously in collection" -- "my environment object" ``` **3: in active collection (being the less commonly wanted)** Do the current behaviour. thanks !

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-27 09:26:21 +02:00

@LucianoMunoz would you expect the same behaviour when appending an object as well?

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-27 09:29:03 +02:00

Changed status from 'Archived' to: 'Needs Triage'

Dalai Felinto reopened this issue

2022-07-27 09:29:03 +02:00

Dalai Felinto commented

2022-07-27 09:29:03 +02:00

Re-opening since we are talking about this. I still believe this should be supported on the collection level though, not on object copy/paste

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2022-07-27 09:37:44 +02:00

I would, yes :)

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-08-19 12:39:15 +02:00

Added subscriber: @lichtwerk

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-08-19 12:39:15 +02:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-08-19 12:39:15 +02:00

In #76246#1396116, @dfelinto wrote:
Re-opening since we are talking about this.

Assume this can be in a "Confirmed" state for now then (since there is not much the #triaging team can do here)

> In #76246#1396116, @dfelinto wrote: > Re-opening since we are talking about this. Assume this can be in a "Confirmed" state for now then (since there is not much the #triaging team can do here)

Philipp Oeser removed the

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"Paste Objects" doesn't copy source objects' collection heirarchy #76246