Grease Pencil Icons do not match in Outliner vs Dope Sheet Editor #95397

New Issue

rd · 2022-02-01T15:43:04+01:00

rd commented

2022-02-01 15:43:04 +01:00

System Information
Operating system: macOS-12.2-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits
Graphics card: Intel(R) Iris(TM) Plus Graphics 655 Intel Inc. 4.1 INTEL-18.4.6

Blender Version
Broken: version: 3.1.0 Alpha, branch: master, commit date: 2022-01-24 22:18, hash: 2bf519d211
Worked: (newest version of Blender that worked as expected)

Short description of error
Grease Pencil Icons do not match in Outliner vs Dopesheet

If you look at the "red" box you will see that the icon is not the same for Grease Pencil Data (Outliner vs Dope Sheet)

(yellow box shows the "Draw Mode" icon in Dope Sheet - in my opinion, It should be changed to something else like Icon used for "Grease Pencil Objects" - Green icon with endpoints

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error
[Please describe the exact steps needed to reproduce the issue]

File >New > 2D Animation
Draw on the screen
Open Outliner Editor
Open Dope Sheet Editor ( in the Dope Sheet Editor Mode select "Grease Pencil" Mode
CHANGE THE NAME OF THE "GREACE PENCIL OBJECT DATA" (green icon with endpoint) in Outliner or Dopesheet

Note:
Outliner Editor icons
The icon for Grease Pencil Object in Outliner is "Orange" line
The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data in Outliner is "Green" line with end points

Dope Sheet Editor icons
The icon for "Grease Pencil Mode" in drop down box is "Drawing Mode" icon for 3D ViewPort
The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data Channel area is "Drawing Mode" icon for 3D ViewPort

From the blender documentation
Channels Region

Grease Pencil (light blue)
The channels’ region shows the Grease Pencil data-blocks containing the layers. Multiple blocks are used for each area (e.g. one for the 3D Viewport and the Image editor).

Layers (gray)
These channels contain the keyframes to which the
layers are bound.

The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data in Dope sheet Channel Region should be "Green" line with end points ( as I am suggesting) or "Orange" line

As an artist , icons in the User Interface really help me understand how use the user interface in blender. I believe this change could be made and really help the clarity of Blender , The dopesheet and UI.

Blender is a wonderful tool and thanks again to all the developers.
I know these can be tough changes....but I think this might be needed for making UI clarity.

Smartdog
We all learn by sharing what we know

**System Information** Operating system: macOS-12.2-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits Graphics card: Intel(R) Iris(TM) Plus Graphics 655 Intel Inc. 4.1 INTEL-18.4.6 **Blender Version** Broken: version: 3.1.0 Alpha, branch: master, commit date: 2022-01-24 22:18, hash: `2bf519d211` Worked: (newest version of Blender that worked as expected) **Short description of error** Grease Pencil Icons do not match in Outliner vs Dopesheet ![default Outliner and Dope Sheet .png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839392/default_Outliner_and_Dope_Sheet_.png) If you look at the "red" box you will see that the icon is not the same for Grease Pencil Data (Outliner vs Dope Sheet) ![Grease Pencil Icons - Dope Sheet vs Outliner.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839292/Grease_Pencil_Icons_-_Dope_Sheet_vs_Outliner.png) (yellow box shows the "Draw Mode" icon in Dope Sheet - in my opinion, It should be changed to something else like Icon used for "Grease Pencil Objects" - Green icon with endpoints ![Dope Sheet Dropdown Menu.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839320/Dope_Sheet_Dropdown_Menu.png) **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** [Please describe the exact steps needed to reproduce the issue] 1) File >New > 2D Animation 2) Draw on the screen 3) Open Outliner Editor 4) Open Dope Sheet Editor ( in the Dope Sheet Editor Mode select "Grease Pencil" Mode 5) CHANGE THE NAME OF THE "GREACE PENCIL OBJECT DATA" (green icon with endpoint) in Outliner or Dopesheet Note: Outliner Editor icons The icon for Grease Pencil Object in Outliner is "Orange" line The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data in Outliner is "Green" line with end points Dope Sheet Editor icons The icon for "Grease Pencil Mode" in drop down box is "Drawing Mode" icon for 3D ViewPort The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data Channel area is "Drawing Mode" icon for 3D ViewPort From the blender documentation Channels Region Grease Pencil (light blue) The channels’ region shows the Grease Pencil data-blocks containing the layers. Multiple blocks are used for each area (e.g. one for the 3D Viewport and the Image editor). Layers (gray) These channels contain the keyframes to which the layers are bound. The icon for Grease Pencil Object Data in Dope sheet Channel Region should be "Green" line with end points ( as I am suggesting) or "Orange" line As an artist , icons in the User Interface really help me understand how use the user interface in blender. I believe this change could be made and really help the clarity of Blender , The dopesheet and UI. Blender is a wonderful tool and thanks again to all the developers. I know these can be tough changes....but I think this might be needed for making UI clarity. Smartdog We all learn by sharing what we know

rd commented

2022-02-01 15:43:04 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Smartdog

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-02-01 16:34:59 +01:00

Added subscribers: @antoniov, @lichtwerk

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-02-01 16:34:59 +01:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Needs Developer To Reproduce'

Philipp Oeser commented

2022-02-01 16:34:59 +01:00

Colorcoding I would say is not a bug (monochrome versions being used in animation editors is common to all object types in blender, not just greasepencil).

Code uses different icons, ICON_GREASEPENCIL, OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL, OUTLINER_DATA_GREASEPENCIL (not sure though why they are so different?

@antoniov:

rna_enum_id_type_items usually uses the _DATA version of the icon, want to check intentions?
can you comment on the difference between ICON_GREASEPENCIL & OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL

Dont think this is a bug, just asking

Colorcoding I would say is not a bug (monochrome versions being used in animation editors is common to all object types in blender, not just greasepencil). Code uses different icons, `ICON_GREASEPENCIL`, `OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL`, `OUTLINER_DATA_GREASEPENCIL` (not sure though why they are so different? @antoniov: - `rna_enum_id_type_items` usually uses the `_DATA` version of the icon, want to check intentions? - can you comment on the difference between `ICON_GREASEPENCIL` & `OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL` Dont think this is a bug, just asking

rd commented

2022-02-01 17:46:31 +01:00

Just to be clear:

This is the default Outliner Editor and Dope Sheet Editor ( Grease Pencil Mode) setup

These images are suggestion for UI Clarity in Dope Sheet Channel Region ( the potential bug with icon) and a suggestion for the dope sheet Grease Pencil mode drop down menu.

Just to be clear: This is the default Outliner Editor and Dope Sheet Editor ( Grease Pencil Mode) setup ![default Outliner and Dope Sheet .png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839657/default_Outliner_and_Dope_Sheet_.png) These images are suggestion for UI Clarity in Dope Sheet Channel Region ( the potential bug with icon) and a suggestion for the dope sheet Grease Pencil mode drop down menu. ![Suggested Grease Pencil Icons - Dope Sheet and Outliner.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839675/Suggested_Grease_Pencil_Icons_-_Dope_Sheet_and_Outliner.png) ![Dope Sheet Dropdown Menu.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12839679/Dope_Sheet_Dropdown_Menu.png)

Antonio Vazquez commented

2022-02-02 10:01:52 +01:00

Added subscriber: @mendio

Antonio Vazquez commented

2022-02-02 10:01:52 +01:00

In #95397#1299343, @lichtwerk wrote:
Colorcoding I would say is not a bug (monochrome versions being used in animation editors is common to all object types in blender, not just greasepencil).

Code uses different icons, ICON_GREASEPENCIL, OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL, OUTLINER_DATA_GREASEPENCIL (not sure though why they are so different?

@antoniov:

rna_enum_id_type_items usually uses the _DATA version of the icon, want to check intentions?

can you comment on the difference between ICON_GREASEPENCIL & OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL

Dont think this is a bug, just asking

Really not sure about why we used an icon... I guess this is the result of developments in different moments and we would need to run a UI icon cleanup to ensure we are consistent. @mendio What do you think about icons? Do you think we can improve consistency?

> In #95397#1299343, @lichtwerk wrote: > Colorcoding I would say is not a bug (monochrome versions being used in animation editors is common to all object types in blender, not just greasepencil). > > Code uses different icons, `ICON_GREASEPENCIL`, `OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL`, `OUTLINER_DATA_GREASEPENCIL` (not sure though why they are so different? > > @antoniov: > - `rna_enum_id_type_items` usually uses the `_DATA` version of the icon, want to check intentions? > - can you comment on the difference between `ICON_GREASEPENCIL` & `OUTLINER_OB_GREASEPENCIL` > > Dont think this is a bug, just asking Really not sure about why we used an icon... I guess this is the result of developments in different moments and we would need to run a UI icon cleanup to ensure we are consistent. @mendio What do you think about icons? Do you think we can improve consistency?

rd commented

2022-02-02 14:38:48 +01:00

After more investigation, the Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor ( while in Grease Pencil Mode) Icons are the only icon/s that needs to be reviewed.

As an Artist and teacher, the UI consistency is why I am suggesting a change to Icon/s in Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor ( while in "Grease Pencil Mode").

If you rename the Object Data (green squiggle icon) in the Outliner Editor or rename the Channel (solid pencil icon) in the Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor you will see the UI Visual inconsistency I am trying to point out:

There are different Icons next to the same name ( ok this can be explained by Every 2D Layer correspond to a Channel in the Dope Sheet editor (in Grease Pencil mode). But does not explain why the "Draw mode Icon" mode was chosen , In my option, for UI clarity, a different icon could/should be used.

Making the following observations (as I understand Grease Pencil iconography - please let me know if I am not understand something correctly):

3D Viewport Editor:

Draw Mode Icon (solid pencil icon) Ok..... this make sense visually and structurally

Outliner Editor:

Show Mode Column ( Solid Pencil icon )
Grease Pencil Objects ("Orange" squiggle icon)
Grease Pencil Data Object ( "Green" squiggle icon)
Grease Pencil Layer ( outline Pencil icon with solid eraser)

When put all these icons together....all make sense ( at least to me ) structurally and visually:
I read as "Object selected in Draw Mode > Grease Pencil Object > Grease Pencil Object Data > Grease Pencil Layer"

Dope Sheet (Grease Pencil mode)

Dope Sheet Drop down
- Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon )
Channel Region
- Channel ( Grease Pencil Data Object) Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon ) ** This could/should be Grease Pencil Object Data icon
- Channel ( Grease Pencil Layer) ( No Icon at all)

The drop down box use of "Draw Mode Icon" works and makes visual sense.

What does not make a lot of sense visually is using the "Draw Mode Icon" again in the Channel Region to express "Grease Pencil data-blocks containing the layers"
as it states in the Blender Documentation for Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode)

Here is the Blender Documentation for Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode):
Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode )

@mendio I would like to suggest this visual solution/change to the Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode)

Suggested fix for Dope Sheet (Grease Pencil mode)

Dope Sheet Drop down
Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon )
Channel Region
Channel - Grease Pencil Data Object (Grease Pencil Object Data icon - mono color )
Channel - Grease Pencil Layer ( No Icon at all)

This all visually "reads" so much better, in my opinion and logical links the Channels to the Layers in the Outliner and Properties Editors. It uses the same visual structure and visual language.

@antoniov @mendio Thank you both ( and to the other Grease pencil developers. Your work is really appreciated and amazing...my suggestions to improve this part of Blender are to make it the developers vision clearer for Artist and other Blenderheads to use ( like Ton always talks about).

.

After more investigation, the Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor ( while in Grease Pencil Mode) Icons are the only icon/s that needs to be reviewed. As an Artist and teacher, the UI consistency is why I am suggesting a change to Icon/s in Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor ( while in "Grease Pencil Mode"). **If you rename the Object Data (green squiggle icon) in the Outliner Editor or rename the Channel (solid pencil icon) in the Channel Region of the Dope Sheet Editor you will see the UI Visual inconsistency I am trying to point out:** - There are different Icons next to the same name ( ok this can be explained by Every 2D Layer correspond to a Channel in the Dope Sheet editor (in Grease Pencil mode). But does not explain why the "Draw mode Icon" mode was chosen , In my option, for UI clarity, a different icon could/should be used. Making the following observations (as I understand Grease Pencil iconography - please let me know if I am not understand something correctly): *3D Viewport Editor*: - Draw Mode Icon (solid pencil icon) Ok..... this make sense visually and structurally ![3D Viewport - Draw Mode Icon .png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12841764/3D_Viewport_-_Draw_Mode_Icon_.png) *Outliner Editor:* - Show Mode Column ( Solid Pencil icon ) - Grease Pencil Objects ("Orange" squiggle icon) - Grease Pencil Data Object ( "Green" squiggle icon) - Grease Pencil Layer ( outline Pencil icon with solid eraser) When put all these icons together....all make sense ( at least to me ) structurally and visually: I read as "Object selected in Draw Mode > Grease Pencil Object > Grease Pencil Object Data > Grease Pencil Layer" ![Outliner - Grease Pencil Icons working together.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12841784/Outliner_-_Grease_Pencil_Icons_working_together.png) *Dope Sheet (Grease Pencil mode)* - Dope Sheet Drop down - Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon ) - Channel Region - Channel ( Grease Pencil Data Object) Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon ) ** This could/should be Grease Pencil Object Data icon - Channel ( Grease Pencil Layer) ( No Icon at all) ![Dope Sheet - Grease Pencil Mode.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12841872/Dope_Sheet_-_Grease_Pencil_Mode.png) The drop down box use of "Draw Mode Icon" works and makes visual sense. What does not make a lot of sense visually is using the "Draw Mode Icon" again in the Channel Region to express "Grease Pencil data-blocks containing the layers" as it states in the Blender Documentation for Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode) Here is the Blender Documentation for Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode): [Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode )](https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/latest/editors/dope_sheet/grease_pencil.html) @mendio I would like to suggest this visual solution/change to the Dope Sheet ( Grease Pencil Mode) ![Suggested fix for Grease Pencil Mode.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12841907/Suggested_fix_for_Grease_Pencil_Mode.png) Suggested fix for Dope Sheet (Grease Pencil mode) Dope Sheet Drop down Draw Mode Icon ( Solid Pencil icon ) Channel Region Channel - Grease Pencil Data Object (Grease Pencil Object Data icon - mono color ) Channel - Grease Pencil Layer ( No Icon at all) This all visually "reads" so much better, in my opinion and logical links the Channels to the Layers in the Outliner and Properties Editors. It uses the same visual structure and visual language. @antoniov @mendio Thank you both ( and to the other Grease pencil developers. Your work is really appreciated and amazing...my suggestions to improve this part of Blender are to make it the developers vision clearer for Artist and other Blenderheads to use ( like Ton always talks about). .

Antonio Vazquez commented

2022-02-02 15:48:52 +01:00

IMHO the icon change makes sense. I have done a test.

Now it seems more consistent.

@mendio if you agree, I can commit the change.

IMHO the icon change makes sense. I have done a test. ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12842026/image.png) Now it seems more consistent. @mendio if you agree, I can commit the change.

Antonio Vazquez self-assigned this 2022-02-02 15:49:33 +01:00

Matias Mendiola commented

2022-02-02 16:30:35 +01:00

In #95397#1300191, @antoniov wrote:
IMHO the icon change makes sense. I have done a test.

Now it seems more consistent.

@mendio if you agree, I can commit the change.

Yes, this was legacy from the first Grease Pencil implementation in the dopesheet, it's ok for me to go ahead with the icon change as in your mockup

> In #95397#1300191, @antoniov wrote: > IMHO the icon change makes sense. I have done a test. > > ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12842026/image.png) > > Now it seems more consistent. > > @mendio if you agree, I can commit the change. Yes, this was legacy from the first Grease Pencil implementation in the dopesheet, it's ok for me to go ahead with the icon change as in your mockup

blender-admin commented

2022-02-02 16:33:15 +01:00

This issue was referenced by f0cfa94d94

This issue was referenced by f0cfa94d94c70b2410cc9e7474ebb3c6edcb2e16

Antonio Vazquez commented

2022-02-02 16:33:51 +01:00

Changed status from 'Needs Developer To Reproduce' to: 'Resolved'

Antonio Vazquez closed this issue

2022-02-02 16:33:51 +01:00

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Grease Pencil Icons do not match in Outliner vs Dope Sheet Editor #95397