Manipulator widgt inconsistent in placement #76533

New Issue

john · 2020-05-08T06:26:45+02:00

john commented

2020-05-08 06:26:45 +02:00

System Information
Operating system: Darwin-19.4.0-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits
Graphics card: Intel Iris Pro OpenGL Engine Intel Inc. 4.1 INTEL-14.5.22

Blender Version
Broken: version: 2.82 (sub 7), branch: master, commit date: 2020-03-12 05:06, hash: 375c7dc4ca
Worked: (optional)

Short description of error
When trying to move e.g. edges in Blender, the manipulator widget (the thing with the colored axes that lets you drag edges and vertices) often does not appear in the "right" place.
Sometimes the widget appears right next to the edge/vertex you're moving (good!) and sometimes it appears only in the middle of the object (bad, when the object is large and you're trying to position accurately!).
I have tried e.g. setting the object origin to the 3d cursor with the cursor positioned next to the edge or vertex I'm trying to move, but that approach hardly ever works.
In short, the manipulator widget is problematic or outright broken in many cases, rendering it useless.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error

Delete all default objects

Create a plane
Go to edit mode
Activate the Move Tool to see the gizmo
Set the Pivot Transform Point to Active Element
Go to face selection mode and activate the face
Go to vertex selection mode and select two vertices of an edge
Go to edge selection mode

Now notice that the pivot point is in the middle of the face despite the selected edge.

active_pivot_bug.blend

**System Information** Operating system: Darwin-19.4.0-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits Graphics card: Intel Iris Pro OpenGL Engine Intel Inc. 4.1 INTEL-14.5.22 **Blender Version** Broken: version: 2.82 (sub 7), branch: master, commit date: 2020-03-12 05:06, hash: `375c7dc4ca` Worked: (optional) **Short description of error** When trying to move e.g. edges in Blender, the manipulator widget (the thing with the colored axes that lets you drag edges and vertices) often does not appear in the "right" place. Sometimes the widget appears right next to the edge/vertex you're moving (good!) and sometimes it appears only in the middle of the object (bad, when the object is large and you're trying to position accurately!). I have tried e.g. setting the object origin to the 3d cursor with the cursor positioned next to the edge or vertex I'm trying to move, but that approach hardly ever works. In short, the manipulator widget is problematic or outright broken in many cases, rendering it useless. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** # Delete all default objects - Create a plane - Go to edit mode - Activate the `Move Tool` to see the gizmo - Set the `Pivot Transform Point` to `Active Element` - Go to face selection mode and activate the face - Go to vertex selection mode and select two vertices of an edge - Go to edge selection mode Now notice that the pivot point is in the middle of the face despite the selected edge. [active_pivot_bug.blend](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8520856/active_pivot_bug.blend)

john commented

2020-05-08 06:26:45 +02:00

Added subscriber: @jgrime

Alaska commented

2020-05-08 09:22:46 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Alaska

Alaska commented

2020-05-08 09:22:46 +02:00

I'm having trouble understanding your original report, but I will try and answer or clarify some things.

Sometimes the widget appears right next to the edge/vertex you're moving (good!) and sometimes it appears only in the middle of the object (bad, when the object is large and you're trying to position accurately!).

The gizmo (widget) will appear in different places depending on a bunch of settings. For example, when you have multiple objects, edges, or vertices selected, the Gizmo will appear at the median point of everything selected. In edit mode this is the median point of the selected vertices, edges, and faces. In Object mode this is the median of the object origins of the objects you have selected. However, you can change the computed location of the gizmo with the "Transform pivot point" option:
{F8520238}
Note that changing the transform pivot point changes, the pivot point. This is a important thing to keep in mind when using the scale or rotate tool as all actions will occur from the new pivot point defined by that setting.

Create a square plane, go into edit mode, press 2 and select an edge, drag the edge far in one direction using the manipulator widget. Pretty soon you have to move the edge off the screen to actually get to the manipulator to move the edge - which is clearly a nonsensical user interface decision.

This seems unrelated to your original description of the issue. In your original description you talk about how the gizmo is mis-placed when selecting certain objects, but in your "steps to reproduce" you're talking about how you can move a gizmo off the edge of the screen, something different entirely. This also seems like a request to change the current implementation of the gizmo system to stop this behavior. Feature requests should be made on right-click select . Being able to move the gizmo off the edge of the screen is not a bug with Blender.

I should note however that I'm unable to see what's happening on your computer, so the behavior you're experiencing may be a bug. If you would like, you can test Blender 2.83 and 2.90 and see if any of the bug fixes for those versions fix things for you. https://builder.blender.org/download/
You could also share images of what you're experiencing so we can better understand it.

I'm having trouble understanding your original report, but I will try and answer or clarify some things. >Sometimes the widget appears right next to the edge/vertex you're moving (good!) and sometimes it appears only in the middle of the object (bad, when the object is large and you're trying to position accurately!). The gizmo (widget) will appear in different places depending on a bunch of settings. For example, when you have multiple objects, edges, or vertices selected, the Gizmo will appear at the median point of everything selected. In edit mode this is the median point of the selected vertices, edges, and faces. In Object mode this is the median of the object origins of the objects you have selected. However, you can change the computed location of the gizmo with the "Transform pivot point" option: {F8520238} Note that changing the transform pivot point changes, the pivot point. This is a important thing to keep in mind when using the scale or rotate tool as all actions will occur from the new pivot point defined by that setting. >Create a square plane, go into edit mode, press 2 and select an edge, drag the edge far in one direction using the manipulator widget. Pretty soon you have to move the edge off the screen to actually get to the manipulator to move the edge - which is clearly a nonsensical user interface decision. This seems unrelated to your original description of the issue. In your original description you talk about how the gizmo is mis-placed when selecting certain objects, but in your "steps to reproduce" you're talking about how you can move a gizmo off the edge of the screen, something different entirely. This also seems like a request to change the current implementation of the gizmo system to stop this behavior. Feature requests should be made on [right-click select ](https://blender.community/c/rightclickselect/). Being able to move the gizmo off the edge of the screen is not a bug with Blender. I should note however that I'm unable to see what's happening on your computer, so the behavior you're experiencing may be a bug. If you would like, you can test Blender 2.83 and 2.90 and see if any of the bug fixes for those versions fix things for you. https://builder.blender.org/download/ You could also share images of what you're experiencing so we can better understand it.

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 15:20:24 +02:00

Added subscriber: @mano-wii

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 15:20:24 +02:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Archived'

Germano Cavalcante closed this issue

2020-05-08 15:20:24 +02:00

Germano Cavalcante self-assigned this 2020-05-08 15:20:24 +02:00

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 15:20:24 +02:00

If I understood correctly the problem is that both the edge and the manipulator get out of screen.
If that is the case this is not a bug. The manipulator is always positioned at the origin pivot.
This pivot is explained in the @Alaska comment.

This report is unclear about the bug.
Please submit a new report and carefully follow the instructions.
A guideline for making a good bug report can be found at https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Process/Bug_Reports

If I understood correctly the problem is that both the edge and the manipulator get out of screen. If that is the case this is not a bug. The manipulator is always positioned at the origin pivot. This pivot is explained in the @Alaska comment. This report is unclear about the bug. Please submit a new report and carefully follow the instructions. A guideline for making a good bug report can be found at https://wiki.blender.org/wiki/Process/Bug_Reports

john commented

2020-05-08 15:24:41 +02:00

> In edit mode this is the median point of the selected vertices, edges, and faces ...

Not for me.

I’ve attached a screenshot in Edit mode (“1.png") where I’ve selected an edge (indicated by the black arrow). I see no manipulator widget at the median point of the two vertices.

However, if I zoom out a lot I can see the manipulator widget … right in the middle of the object, where I can’t actually use it unless I lose fine control over positioning the edge I’ve selected (see screenshot “2.png”).

As you can see in the screenshots, I have the pivot mode set to “Active Element”. According to the Blender manual: “The active element can be an object, vertex, edge or a face. The active element is the last one to be selected …"

https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/latest/scene_layout/object/editing/transform/control/pivot_point/active_element.html

This is clearly wrong for the edge that I selected to move.

This seems unrelated to your original description of the issue. In your original description you talk about how the gizmo is mis-placed when selecting certain objects, but in your "steps to reproduce" you're talking about how you can move a gizmo off the edge of the screen, something different entirely. This also seems like a request to change the current implementation of the gizmo system to stop this behavior. Feature requests should be made on right-click select. Being able to move the gizmo off the edge of the screen is not a bug with Blender.

I don’t know why you think the widget being unusable due to it’s position “seems unrelated to my original description of the issue”. It’s exactly the same issue - the manipulator widget is not in a sensible place when I’m trying to move an edge.

It’s not a request for a new feature, I’m asking for the existing feature to work as described in the manual.

J.

**> In edit mode this is the median point of the selected vertices, edges, and faces ...** Not for me. I’ve attached a screenshot in Edit mode (“1.png") where I’ve selected an edge (indicated by the black arrow). I see no manipulator widget at the median point of the two vertices. However, if I zoom out a lot I can see the manipulator widget … right in the middle of the object, where I can’t actually use it unless I lose fine control over positioning the edge I’ve selected (see screenshot “2.png”). As you can see in the screenshots, I have the pivot mode set to “Active Element”. According to the Blender manual: “The active element can be an object, vertex, edge or a face. The active element is the last one to be selected …" https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/latest/scene_layout/object/editing/transform/control/pivot_point/active_element.html This is clearly wrong for the edge that I selected to move. **This seems unrelated to your original description of the issue. In your original description you talk about how the gizmo is mis-placed when selecting certain objects, but in your "steps to reproduce" you're talking about how you can move a gizmo off the edge of the screen, something different entirely. This also seems like a request to change the current implementation of the gizmo system to stop this behavior. Feature requests should be made on right-click select. Being able to move the gizmo off the edge of the screen is not a bug with Blender.** I don’t know why you think the widget being unusable due to it’s position “seems unrelated to my original description of the issue”. It’s exactly the same issue - the manipulator widget is not in a sensible place when I’m trying to move an edge. It’s not a request for a new feature, I’m asking for the existing feature to work as described in the manual. J. ![2.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8520737/2.png) ![1.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8520738/1.png)

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 15:32:26 +02:00

Can you provide a simple file showing the problem?

john commented

2020-05-08 15:43:57 +02:00

Sure, attached.

Select the "lowest" edge, and take a look where the manipulator appears.test.blend.zip

Sure, attached. Select the "lowest" edge, and take a look where the manipulator appears.[test.blend.zip](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8520779/test.blend.zip)

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 16:07:08 +02:00

The file inded shows an inconsistent status between the selection and the pivot center.

But I can't reproduce the problem from scratch.
The description in the report does not help much.
Knowing how you got there is important to confirm the bug.

The file inded shows an inconsistent status between the selection and the pivot center. But I can't reproduce the problem from scratch. The description in the report does not help much. Knowing how you got there is important to confirm the bug.

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 16:31:57 +02:00

Changed status from 'Archived' to: 'Confirmed'

Germano Cavalcante reopened this issue

2020-05-08 16:31:57 +02:00

Germano Cavalcante commented

2020-05-08 16:36:00 +02:00

I can confirm. But it is difficult to reach the state shown in the blend file.
I edited the description but I wonder if that really makes "the manipulator widget problematic or outright broken in many cases, rendering it useless."

I can confirm. But it is difficult to reach the state shown in the blend file. I edited the description but I wonder if that really makes "the manipulator widget problematic or outright broken in many cases, rendering it useless."

john commented

2020-05-08 17:01:47 +02:00

I'm sorry, but if common/fundamental actions trigger the problem (select faces, edges, and vertices in Edit mode, then try to manipulate an edge) then it's not "difficult to reach the state shown in the file".

If the responses in this report are indicative, it's easy to see how bugs in basic functionality would persist in Blender.

I'm sorry, but if common/fundamental actions trigger the problem (select faces, edges, and vertices in Edit mode, then try to manipulate an edge) then it's not "difficult to reach the state shown in the file". If the responses in this report are indicative, it's easy to see how bugs in basic functionality would persist in Blender.

Alaska commented

2020-05-09 00:01:16 +02:00

@mano-wii Looking at the .blend file attached by @jgrime I believe the reason why the gizmo is in the "wrong" position is because the pivot point is set to "active element" but there is no active element. An edge is selected, but it's not an active edge (active edges are signified by it being white) so the gizmo defaults to the object origin.

This is also true for the screenshot shared by @jgrime:

Notice how the edge is not the active edge (not white)

Or maybe I'm just mis-understanding this.

@mano-wii Looking at the .blend file attached by @jgrime I believe the reason why the gizmo is in the "wrong" position is because the pivot point is set to "active element" but there is no active element. An edge is selected, but it's not an active edge (active edges are signified by it being white) so the gizmo defaults to the object origin. This is also true for the screenshot shared by @jgrime: ![1.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8520738/1.png) Notice how the edge is not the active edge (not white) Or maybe I'm just mis-understanding this.

Alaska commented

2020-05-20 06:05:44 +02:00

Just checking in on this report as it's been a week and a half. @jgrime, have you figured out a way to reliably reproduce this issue? Or is the issue due to the "non-active edge" issue I talked about in #76533#927378.

blender-admin commented

2020-06-02 10:37:22 +02:00

This issue was referenced by ae2f21f378

This issue was referenced by ae2f21f3783563eec3e2f8b74aa22acc74ac16b7

Campbell Barton commented

2020-06-02 10:39:11 +02:00

Changed status from 'Confirmed' to: 'Resolved'

Campbell Barton closed this issue

2020-06-02 10:39:11 +02:00

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Manipulator widgt inconsistent in placement #76533

Delete all default objects