Synchronizing editors between workspaces #76810

New Issue

Michael Soluyanov · 2020-05-16T20:34:58+02:00

Michael Soluyanov commented

2020-05-16 20:34:58 +02:00

Here is a design discussion about synchronizing editors between workspaces.

Basically, synchronizing editors try to keep content in editors with same type when you switch between workspaces.

Working prototype and previous discussion is here https://developer.blender.org/D7272

Problems, that we need to discourse:

How to enable synchronizing?
If workspaces have more than one editor with same type, how to determine which area in one workspace corresponds to the area in another workspace?
What settings we heed to synchronize - view position / window scroll / settings / open-close state in Outliner
If I change editor type in area, that have marked as synchronized, what should Blender do? Change editor type in all synchronized areas, or disable synchronizing for current area? - my current answer is "disable"
If Blender changes editor type in area by image editor, while rendering, or file browser, what should it do? Change editor types in all synchronized areas, or disable synchronizing for current area? - my current answer is "change editor types"
Should Blender allow creating new synchronizing links, instead using existing ones (For example, synchronizing areas in workspaces W1 <=> W2 and W3 <=> W4, instead W1 <=> W2 <=> W3 <=> W4 )

Solutions

Add a Synchronize property for areas. When two areas in different workspaces are marked as Synchronize, they get same Sinc ID, and Blender will synchronize areas by this ID.

What settings we heed to synchronize

I noted, that synchronization of view position approved by all, but not all wants synchronization of other settings. So there is a suggestion to divide synchronization into several parts: view position, window scroll and settings, open-close state.

Possible solutions how to do this:

Add different menu items:

for viewport: Sinc View, Sinc Settings
for outliner: Sinc Scroll, Sinc State
for 2d editors: Sinc scroll, Sinc Settings

I am not a fan of this because it is not clear. That will happen then one area will mark as Sinc View, other Sinc Settings?

Add settings in User Preferences:

View and Scroll Possition
Area Settings

Add only synchronizing view position / window scroll / open-close state in Outliner only and add an operator "Copy Overlay (Shading, Gizmo) Settings to all Viewports (Editors)". By the way, it will be nice to have this operator and without this synchronization task
Synchronize all settings, but add more settings to workspace. For example, assign Shading Mode to the workspace (where now Object Mode selector is located). Or maybe, Minimum Shading level. It will be useful for Shading workspace. When you tap to Shading workspace from Solid mode, you switch to "Material Preview", but if you already have Rendered mode, it will be nice to keep it and do not downgrade it to "Material Preview"

UI

The new menu View - Area - Sinc, made like a property with checkbox. If it checked, area is synchronized.
I suggest some different variations, how menu can be looks like, depends on current situation:

I created this design because @JulianEisel suggest this. This is my first task, if I did something wrong, notify me.

Here is a design discussion about synchronizing editors between workspaces. Basically, synchronizing editors try to keep content in editors with same type when you switch between workspaces. Working prototype and previous discussion is here https://developer.blender.org/D7272 **Problems, that we need to discourse:** 1) How to enable synchronizing? 2) If workspaces have more than one editor with same type, how to determine which area in one workspace corresponds to the area in another workspace? 3) What settings we heed to synchronize - view position / window scroll / settings / open-close state in Outliner 4) If I change editor type in area, that have marked as synchronized, what should Blender do? Change editor type in all synchronized areas, or disable synchronizing for current area? - my current answer is "disable" 5) If Blender changes editor type in area by image editor, while rendering, or file browser, what should it do? Change editor types in all synchronized areas, or disable synchronizing for current area? - my current answer is "change editor types" 6) Should Blender allow creating new synchronizing links, instead using existing ones (For example, synchronizing areas in workspaces W1 <=> W2 and W3 <=> W4, instead W1 <=> W2 <=> W3 <=> W4 ) **Solutions** Add a Synchronize property for areas. When two areas in different workspaces are marked as Synchronize, they get same Sinc ID, and Blender will synchronize areas by this ID. **What settings we heed to synchronize** I noted, that synchronization of view position approved by all, but not all wants synchronization of other settings. So there is a suggestion to divide synchronization into several parts: view position, window scroll and settings, open-close state. Possible solutions how to do this: 1) Add different menu items: - for viewport: Sinc View, Sinc Settings - for outliner: Sinc Scroll, Sinc State - for 2d editors: Sinc scroll, Sinc Settings ``` I am not a fan of this because it is not clear. That will happen then one area will mark as Sinc View, other Sinc Settings? ``` 2) Add settings in User Preferences: - View and Scroll Possition - Area Settings 3) Add only synchronizing view position / window scroll / open-close state in Outliner only and add an operator "Copy Overlay (Shading, Gizmo) Settings to all Viewports (Editors)". By the way, it will be nice to have this operator and without this synchronization task 4) Synchronize all settings, but add more settings to workspace. For example, assign Shading Mode to the workspace (where now Object Mode selector is located). Or maybe, Minimum Shading level. It will be useful for Shading workspace. When you tap to Shading workspace from Solid mode, you switch to "Material Preview", but if you already have Rendered mode, it will be nice to keep it and do not downgrade it to "Material Preview" **UI** The new menu View - Area - Sinc, made like a property with checkbox. If it checked, area is synchronized. I suggest some different variations, how menu can be looks like, depends on current situation: ![rect1063.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8546339/rect1063.png) I created this design because @JulianEisel suggest this. This is my first task, if I did something wrong, notify me.

Michael Soluyanov self-assigned this 2020-05-16 20:34:58 +02:00

Michael Soluyanov commented

2020-05-16 20:34:58 +02:00

Added subscribers: @JulianEisel, @crantisz

Debuk commented

2020-05-21 12:37:39 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Debuk

Debuk commented

2020-05-21 13:10:44 +02:00

If workspaces have more than one editor with same type, how to determine which area in one workspace corresponds to the area in another workspace?

This is heavily dependent on if the goal is to support different synchronziation groups/ids for the same editor types or if there is just one sync ID them. (eg have for all 3dviews just one id possible)

If there is just one sync id per areatype, then syncing could be handled like subscribing to its defined id. So more views in a viewport could subsribe to being in sync with that or not and every area could opt out of individual properties associated with this sync id, like pos, shading,...

This comes with limitations in possibilities but would be easier to handle, so my question left open is this, more sync ids per areatype or is that beyond scope ?

> If workspaces have more than one editor with same type, how to determine which area in one workspace corresponds to the area in another workspace? This is heavily dependent on if the goal is to support different synchronziation groups/ids for the same editor types or if there is just one sync ID them. (eg have for all 3dviews just one id possible) If there is just one sync id per areatype, then syncing could be handled like subscribing to its defined id. So more views in a viewport could subsribe to being in sync with that or not and every area could opt out of individual properties associated with this sync id, like pos, shading,... This comes with limitations in possibilities but would be easier to handle, so my question left open is this, `more sync ids per areatype or is that beyond scope` ?

Michael Soluyanov commented

2020-05-21 14:19:57 +02:00

In the last implementation, the sinc IDs in no way depend on the type of editor. It allows keeping areas synchronized, even they temporary replaced by image editor during rendering. And, of-course, it allows synchronizing more than one editor with same type

Michael Soluyanov commented

2020-06-02 19:15:34 +02:00

MACHIN3tools realization via pie-menu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdKkskyFDN4&feature=youtu.be&t=263

Bulat commented

2020-06-23 11:36:38 +02:00

Added subscriber: @BulatKR

Characterhero commented

2020-06-24 08:53:07 +02:00

Added subscriber: @TheCharacterhero-4

Paul Kotelevets commented

2020-06-24 22:30:32 +02:00

Added subscriber: @1D_Inc

Paul Kotelevets commented

2020-06-24 22:30:32 +02:00

In #76810#943037, @crantisz wrote:
MACHIN3tools realization via pie-menu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdKkskyFDN4&feature=youtu.be&t=263

Changing the 3D view is the most disorienting in my opinion.

> In #76810#943037, @crantisz wrote: > MACHIN3tools realization via pie-menu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdKkskyFDN4&feature=youtu.be&t=263 Changing the 3D view is the most disorienting in my opinion.

Luciano Laudani commented

2020-08-20 17:41:24 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Luxary

Luciano Laudani commented

2020-08-20 17:41:24 +02:00

I think this design proposal could be reworked in favour of simplicity. Two main things come to mind:

The sync toggle should probably be a global property that spans across workspaces. The idea would be to activate a Global Sync that stays true for all 3D Views until it's turned off.
Everything should be in plain sight. With a single glance the user should be able to tell if the current viewport is synchronized, and if global sync is active at all.

I don't the Global Sync should carry anything other than view_location, view_rotation, view_distance and view_perspective. Perhaps, lens, clip_start and clip_end as well.
Anything more than that would defy the purpose of having multiple workspaces, which tend to have different view/shader settings specifically because they're designed to be different "environments". The true inconvenience that stems from the current situation, IMHO, is the need to readjust the view when working on a certain part of the scene while hopping between different stages (Modeling, Sculpting, Unwrapping, Shading...).

The global syncing should be fast to toggle on and off. Hiding the option into a context menu is inadequate. It both hides the current Sync state from the user, and "opting in" for each viewport is a lengthy and inconvenient process. Instead, I think it would be easier to have a global setting from which a viewport can "opt out" of, entering in a temporary "Free view" state. Here's a working mock-up I made in python:

2020-08-20_17-38-35.mp4

There are still some problems that need to be addressed, such as handling a workspace with many 3D Views. Offhand, it would seem logical to me to designate one of them as the main one from which you'd copy the view settings. After all, multiple 3D Views in workspace are almost always used to check the scene from different angles, perhaps with different settings. The user would be in charge of selecting which view would be the main one, perhaps from the same popover menu that would dynamically accomodate the settings.

Finally, I wouldn't cram too many features into this proposal. Storing and linking multiple sets of views, for example, is something that is not only potentially confusing, but kinda goes out of the main proposal's scope. Not to mention, there are bundled add-ons that enable this functionality . Keeping it simple and manageable is a good first step to actually have something that embraces Blender's design philosophy.

I think this design proposal could be reworked in favour of simplicity. Two main things come to mind: - The sync toggle should probably be a global property that spans across workspaces. The idea would be to activate a Global Sync that stays true for all 3D Views until it's turned off. - Everything should be in plain sight. With a single glance the user should be able to tell if the current viewport is synchronized, and if global sync is active at all. I don't the Global Sync should carry anything other than `view_location`, `view_rotation`, `view_distance` and `view_perspective`. Perhaps, `lens`, `clip_start` and `clip_end` as well. Anything more than that would defy the purpose of having multiple workspaces, which tend to have different view/shader settings specifically because they're designed to be different "environments". The true inconvenience that stems from the current situation, IMHO, is the need to readjust the view when working on a certain part of the scene while hopping between different stages (Modeling, Sculpting, Unwrapping, Shading...). The global syncing should be fast to toggle on and off. Hiding the option into a context menu is inadequate. It both hides the current Sync state from the user, and "opting in" for each viewport is a lengthy and inconvenient process. Instead, I think it would be easier to have a global setting from which a viewport can "opt out" of, entering in a temporary "Free view" state. Here's a working mock-up I made in python: [2020-08-20_17-38-35.mp4](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F8797030/2020-08-20_17-38-35.mp4) There are still some problems that need to be addressed, such as handling a workspace with many 3D Views. Offhand, it would seem logical to me to designate one of them as the main one from which you'd copy the view settings. After all, multiple 3D Views in workspace are almost always used to check the scene from different angles, perhaps with different settings. The user would be in charge of selecting which view would be the main one, perhaps from the same popover menu that would dynamically accomodate the settings. Finally, I wouldn't cram too many features into this proposal. Storing and linking multiple sets of views, for example, is something that is not only potentially confusing, but kinda goes out of the main proposal's scope. Not to mention, [there are bundled add-ons that enable this functionality ](https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/dev/addons/3d_view/stored_views.html). Keeping it simple and manageable is a good first step to actually have something that embraces Blender's design philosophy.

Neil Smith commented

2020-11-08 12:19:17 +01:00

Added subscriber: @NeilSmith-1

Eugene Du commented

2020-12-05 17:48:41 +01:00

Added subscriber: @APEC

Eugene Du commented

2020-12-05 18:05:07 +01:00

In #76810#999675, @Luxary wrote:

Looks so nice!
The "lock" on views looks just perfect instead of checkboxes.

One thing is to move this option to View - View Sync

> In #76810#999675, @Luxary wrote: Looks so nice! The "lock" on views looks just perfect instead of checkboxes. One thing is to move this option to View - View Sync

Luciano Laudani commented

2020-12-05 18:20:04 +01:00

In #76810#1068964, @APEC wrote:

Well, usually, in the context menus you'd have single-entry operators and nothing else. They're not really meant for checkboxes and stuff.
This was thought more along the lines of Object Types Visibility panel, the functionality of UI elements is pretty similar to that.
Also, I felt like it would have to be as readily accessible as possible, hence why I hacked it in the viewport.

I'm glad you like it, though. But I wonder if this task needs to be re-published, since it's inactive by now.

> In #76810#1068964, @APEC wrote: Well, usually, in the context menus you'd have single-entry operators and nothing else. They're not really meant for checkboxes and stuff. This was thought more along the lines of Object Types Visibility panel, the functionality of UI elements is pretty similar to that. Also, I felt like it would have to be as readily accessible as possible, hence why I hacked it in the viewport. I'm glad you like it, though. But I wonder if this task needs to be re-published, since it's inactive by now.

Eugene Du commented

2020-12-05 19:06:08 +01:00

In #76810#1068978, @Luxary wrote:
They're not really meant for checkboxes and stuff.

Yes, you are right. There is no place in viewport except where it is now or near the "View Object Types".

BTW what we should do to make this design active?

> In #76810#1068978, @Luxary wrote: > They're not really meant for checkboxes and stuff. Yes, you are right. There is no place in viewport except where it is now or near the "View Object Types". BTW what we should do to make this design active?

Luciano Laudani commented

2020-12-05 19:33:31 +01:00

In #76810#1068986, @APEC wrote:
BTW what we should do to make this design active?

Ah, nevermind that, I just noticed it's on the 2.92 Workboard as Short-Term Scope, just not as high in priority, so it's fine the way it is. It will eventually bubble to the top (hopefully) ;)
This thread is meant for design proposals and technical discussion by the way, so we should avoid anything that isn't strictly related to that.

> In #76810#1068986, @APEC wrote: > BTW what we should do to make this design active? Ah, nevermind that, I just noticed it's on the 2.92 Workboard as Short-Term Scope, just not as high in priority, so it's fine the way it is. It will eventually bubble to the top (hopefully) ;) This thread is meant for design proposals and technical discussion by the way, so we should avoid anything that isn't strictly related to that.

Chris Kohl commented

2020-12-06 21:32:49 +01:00

Added subscriber: @ckohl_art

Christophe commented

2021-10-02 13:05:27 +02:00

Added subscriber: @StroBlend

Christophe commented

2021-10-02 13:05:27 +02:00

Hi @Luxary any news here ? is this patch ready ? We have the nicer user interface of all 3D softwares and workspaces is a wonderful/powerful feature to quickly jump between different workflow, And THIS please! can really give a better user experience using full worspaces potential! So we don't have to make lot of scroll and rotate of viewport to continue the work on what we were just currently working at!
Blender 3.0 is coming and it will fit perfectly with it!

Hi @Luxary any news here ? is this patch ready ? We have the nicer user interface of all 3D softwares and workspaces is a wonderful/powerful feature to quickly jump between different workflow, And THIS please! can really give a better user experience using full worspaces potential! So we don't have to make lot of scroll and rotate of viewport to continue the work on what we were just currently working at! Blender 3.0 is coming and it will fit perfectly with it!

Eugene Du commented

2022-01-12 08:43:51 +01:00

Would be nice feature for 3.1+
Just to remember for subscribers, this design still exist.

Would be nice feature for 3.1+ Just to remember for subscribers, this design still exist.

Michael Soluyanov commented

2022-01-24 14:25:35 +01:00

I've made an add-on with this functionality:

https://blenderartists.org/t/synchronize-workspaces-blender-add-on/1356695

Post suggestions for improvements, after the add-on will be more polished, I will post it in suggest add-on box.

I've made an add-on with this functionality: https://blenderartists.org/t/synchronize-workspaces-blender-add-on/1356695 Post suggestions for improvements, after the add-on will be more polished, I will post it in suggest add-on box.

GM commented

2022-07-04 14:30:51 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Mentales

Philipp Oeser removed the

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Synchronizing editors between workspaces #76810